You never know with crossbreeds how they are going to turn out, like one parent or the other or a mixture of both

 

Looks more Shih Tzu to me.

 

I think you can definately see both breeds in him, but he face looks very king charles. I asked my hubby for a Shih Tzu puppy for my 30th birthday and we have agreed on getting this pup. He is super cute no matter what but i just want him to be really fluffy. I have looked into the breed alot and its seems as though he will be, he just doesnt look like any of the Cava Tzu's i have seen when researching.

 

Any chance that the parents were not actually the breeds you were told they were? Have you see them at all?
It’s possible for a bitch to mate with another dog as well as the dog she was deliberately bred with and for her to have puppies with different fathers.
Cute little puppy

 

Any chance that the parents were not actually the breeds you were told they were? Have you see them at all?
It's possible for a bitch to mate with another dog as well as the dog she was deliberately bred with and for her to have puppies with different fathers.
Cute little puppy

Well, i thought that at first but the breeder is a friend of my mother in laws so doubt she would say that if it wasnt true. The mum is definitely Shih Tzu and is her pet and she bas kept one of the pups herself. Also, he looks like both breeds. We havent visited yet but are going to see him during the week. It wouldnt put me off at all because he is a goegeous little pup but just wondering how fluffy he will be etc.

 

I think the point we are all trying to make is that you don’t know what to expect because the puppy is a crossbreed. Generally if you cross a longer coated breed with a shorter coated one, the puppies will sway towards the shorter side.

I am hoping the Cavalier father was fully health tested (heart testing, MRI to rule out syringomyelia etc), because if not having a cross would really concern me due to the serious health problems this breed suffers.

 

I think the point we are all trying to make is that you don't know what to expect because the puppy is a crossbreed. Generally if you cross a longer coated breed with a shorter coated one, the puppies will sway towards the shorter side.

I am hoping the Cavalier father was fully health tested (heart testing, MRI to rule out syringomyelia etc), because if not having a cross would really concern me due to the serious health problems this breed suffers.

I will be asking plenty of questions when we got to see him, so il make sure i ask that. Its been my hubby that has been soeaking to her so far and he never looks into anything like that. Im driving him up the wall asking all these questions that he doesnt know the answer to because he hasnt thought to ask. Thats why iv posted on here to get some other peoples opinions really. Thank you for mentioning the health issues, i will be sure to ask about that.

 

I don't think it's possible to tell, I took on my cross breed of indeterminate origins at 20 weeks and he was quite short haired but not any more, he's now very shaggy and has been for years.

 

I would be asking further questions on parental health, rather than what the parents look like. The internal workings in situations like these are much more important (especially when one of the parental breeds has a very unhealthy average) than the 'paint job'.

 

That is what we have asked, parents both have a clean bill of health.
Iv read up on the cross breed too and there doesnt seem to be too much to worry about. Iv been doing alot of research myself of the main issues like health, temprement, grooming, care, exercise etc. The only thing I couldn't find much info on is appearance which is why i asked the question.
I appreciate that you are all trting to assist but i feel a little like you dont think iv bothered to look into the important stuff. That was the first thing i did, on various sites which is why the only thing i asked was about appearance.

 

It's very rare to find breeders who health test when breeding cross breeds, so both parents may be extremely healthy it doesn't mean the pups won't inherit health issues that may have been avoided if health tests were carried out. That said there are plenty of issues that can't be tested for. Just please make sure you don't pay a designer dog price for what is just a cute cross breed.

 

She only wants £350 for him, I trust her too with her being a close friend of my mother in law. I have met her a few times too as she owns the local cafe and go in there with my mother in law. She is very responsible and i dont think she would say they were tested if they werent. I have already looked into insurance etc so will sort that as soon as we get him to make sure we are covered. Xxx

 

Generally speaking, if the breeder had gone to the effort to do all the recommended health screening and beyond, why would they then put their bitch to a completely different breed to produce a crossbreed litter? it wouldn't make much sense.

Of course, if the bitch is KC registered you can put her Kennel Club name into the database online to verify if any of these supposed tests have actually happened.

 

How old is the pup. If it has been to the groomers and clipped I would not expect it to be a young puppy, they are not normally trimmed till at least 6 months old. As others have said it is a cross not a breed so could end up looking like anything. It certainly has more of a Cav head but it is hard to tell. Probably the pictures you have looked at of crosses are of fluffy puppies because that is what sells them. Does not mean they are necessarily fluffy. It is very unlikely the parents have been health tested, more likely just given a once over from the vet. I would not expect to find parents of cross breeds tested though a few rare breeders that are doing the more popular crosses like poodle cross spaniel are sometimes testing.

 

He is 4 months only. She had a litter of 8 pups, she has sold 6 and kept one for herself. This is the last one xxx

 

One of mine is a crossbreed and so I can’t comment on buying them. I really would only get a health tested CKCS as my friend’s developed health problems that were heart breaking.

 

These are the health tests for CKCs:

Mitral Valve Disease of the heart (MVD)
Syringomyelia (SM)
Eye – Hereditary Cataract & Multi-focal Retinal Dysplasia (MRD)

The CKC Club actively encourages its members to test their Cavaliers for heart and eye problems. The Club also encourages its members to MRI screen their stock for syringomyelia prior to breeding.

My neighbour had a rescue CKC with mitrial heart disease and syryngomyelia. Her dog was in a lot of pain and discomfort, had to be on lots of medication all its life and it was heart rending to watch the dog walk in circles, barely able to move at times when it was having a bad phase. Syringomyelia occurs when the brain grows to large for the skull. The effects of this are as you can imagine terrible for the animal concerned.

The reason members on here are recommending you ensure the mum CKC has had all these health tests to ensure her pups won't inherit these diseases is that firstly dogs with these conditions lead painful and often short lives. Secondly if they are not confirmed as free of these diseases it is likely you will face huge vets bills throughout the dogs life. Even if you get insurance the premiums will reflect those issues.

Also supporting someone who breeds but does not health tests their dogs and therefore sells on pups that may be carriers of such diseases who will go on and possibly add to the problem if they are bred is not a good idea.

We only have your best interests and those of the puppies in mind. As much as the pup really looks cute if he becomes a sickly adult you may well face a great deal of disappointment.

 

@Sadie McGarva I know you probably have your heart set on this pup. He's cute, and being a friend of the family I know it's convenient to get him rather than look elsewhere.

But if health is important to you, unless these breeders truly have spent hundreds of pounds on doing these tests (which doesn't sound likely), you should step away and look for a Shih-Tzu or CKCS (or whatever other breed you decide) from properly health-tested parents.

You will have to pay more, and likely look further afield. But you'll be off to a better start.

Remember that veterinary organisations, the Kennel Club and breed clubs recommend these tests for a reason. Breeders that don't utilise the tests generally fail to do so because of cost concerns or ignorance - neither is a promising trait in someone producing people's future pets.

 

Just out of interest, I thought SM was a recessive gene so will a crossbreed suffer with it. In fact so are the heart and eye conditions so surely there is not a risk with a cross breed

 

I think you'll find cross breed can inherit health problems from both parents.

Are they health checked or tested, there's a world of difference between the two.

 

OP, as you were keen to have a Shih-Tzu in the first place why not look for one from KC registered and health tested parents?

Places to look are the KC website and the Champdogs website

 

Well to go back to the original question I would say he looks more Shitzu with Cavalier colouring and he has had his muzzle/chops shaved my own cav x's have always looked more cavalier than bichon right from puppyhood. I own two cross bred Cavalier x Bichons, I kind of knew the risks but I do breathe a sigh of relief every time the vets checks their hearts and say they are good and healthy, if you do go ahead and bring the pup home, get insurance to start from the day you bring him home and go with someone reputable like Pet Plan or Co-op they will cost more but are far better coverage and they don't tend to do huge yearly increases like a lot of other insurances.

For reference this is my boy at around 4months

 

And just so Hilde doesn't feel left out this is her at 4 months apx, her face is more bichon shaped but the ears, legs and tail are cavalier.

 

And just so Hilde doesn't feel left out this is her at 4 months apx, her face is more bichon shaped but the ears, legs and tail are cavalier.

View attachment 360747

Love seeing your two, they're so gorgeous, a lot of purebred cavvies seem to be heading towards being even more dome headed & shorter in the muzzle, not a good look at all.

 

As @simplysardonic says with cats it is best to neuter both males and females. Entire male cats wander long distances in search of females and also have a pungent urine. They also tend to fight other males, get injured and inflict injuries on others. Females can give birth to kittens when still adolescents and the cat population can explode exponentially. Therefore neutering cats is good thing to do.

In dogs it is generally a good idea to spay bitches that aren't going to be bred as they can be at risk of pyometra, some cancers and of unwanted pregnancies. I think many members recommend spaying bitches several months after their first season.

Why not discuss neutering your dog when you visit the vet with your kitten and see what their view is. Then you can consider the options based on your dog and situation.

 

I have cav crosses, paid €50 each for them and their the beat dogs ever. Take them to the vets often enough to get them checked and there’s never ever been and health issues with them and their 5 this year still behaving like puppies(they also still look like puppies)

The pup that you want to buy is absolutely gorgeous. In my opinion he looks more like a Cav. I can also see why he’s already been groomed... mine have to be groomed every 2/3 months but my sister does dog grooming so I pay a lot less than I should be. If you get this pup I hope ye get on great with him

 

I have cav crosses, paid €50 each for them and their the beat dogs ever. Take them to the vets often enough to get them checked and there's never ever been and health issues with them and their 5 this year still behaving like puppies(they also still look like puppies)

The pup that you want to buy is absolutely gorgeous. In my opinion he looks more like a Cav. I can also see why he's already been groomed... mine have to be groomed every 2/3 months but my sister does dog grooming so I pay a lot less than I should be. If you get this pup I hope ye get on great with him

Thank you, thats really fab to hear. Since starting this post we have been sent pictures of before he was clipped and he is very fluffy and shih tzu like. I assume she has clipped him so young due to how hot the weather has been this summer.
Your pups sound lovely. Are yours the same cross breed? Cava x Shih Tzu?

 

I know you most definitely seem to have your heart set on him and I hope with everything that he is healthy and you have a long and lovely time with him. In the family we have untested mongrels as well and whilst it’s not ideal as responsible breeders always test their dogs it is what it is now.
However I don’t think the biggest issue is with them being untested as rarely cross breed breeders health test but the fact the woman has told you both parents were health tested but you have not received the results. Responsible breeders would also vet you very carefully and be very in touch and present with what was going on, whether they already know your mother in law etc their job would always be finding the BEST homes for their pups and as a buyer you would be asked almost as many questions as you would have!
I think people are just trying not to set you up for heartbreak, they aren’t trying to scare you. With cavs health issues are a real concern. I know you are already attached to the pup but it would be even worse to get pup and lose them from health issues etc.
I would be really adamant in finding out what tests both parents have had, and what the results were. Also some official documentation for these results, not just her telling you them.
If she can’t provide them I would really think long and hard.
Why is the pup 16 weeks? That’s quite old for a pup to be going to it’s bew home

 

I know you most definitely seem to have your heart set on him and I hope with everything that he is healthy and you have a long and lovely time with him. In the family we have untested mongrels as well and whilst it's not ideal as responsible breeders always test their dogs it is what it is now.
However I don't think the biggest issue is with them being untested as rarely cross breed breeders health test but the fact the woman has told you both parents were health tested but you have not received the results. Responsible breeders would also vet you very carefully and be very in touch and present with what was going on, whether they already know your mother in law etc their job would always be finding the BEST homes for their pups and as a buyer you would be asked almost as many questions as you would have!
I think people are just trying not to set you up for heartbreak, they aren't trying to scare you. With cavs health issues are a real concern. I know you are already attached to the pup but it would be even worse to get pup and lose them from health issues etc.
I would be really adamant in finding out what tests both parents have had, and what the results were. Also some official documentation for these results, not just her telling you them.
If she can't provide them I would really think long and hard.
Why is the pup 16 weeks? That's quite old for a pup to be going to it's bew home

Hi, we havent asked specifically what tests the parents have had so it may be that they have just had a general check over like some one has previously mentioned on this thread. She has said that she has had no issues so far with her dog (the mum who is king charles). It could also be that my hubby is just humering me saying that she has said that as he thinks im being a pest asking all of the questions i have. Either way, i know plenty of people dont ask as many questions about health checks etc so i dont want to worry to much about it. (Im already a worrier) We have already agreed to take the pup and we will love and care for him no matter what. I have already got insurance quotes but want to dig a bit deeper into what they cover before i commit to one as compare the market info is very vague.
Also, we are getting him at 4 months due to him being the last of the litter and after the ones that have already sold, she has had no further interest in the pups. She is keeping one pup herself too.

 

Well it looks like you are having your puppy, make sure you get a good insurance and remember it may not cover anything that the puppy maybe born with.

Look forward to seeing more pictures of him as he grows and I hope you have a very happy life together.

 

I'm late to the party here. Hello, @SadieMcGarva I think you are obviously half in love with this pup already and your husband seems to have committed you further the advice you have received is excellent and should anyone else read the thread before buying a puppy I would really advise them to read the thread carefully.

Now health tests aside if you have already decided to take a chance on this puppy's health I would suggest you look at how the puppy has been raised which is equally important. Having taken on a crossbreed dog aged 10 months who hadn't had the benefit of careful raising I can tell you it's incredibly difficult to help a dog who hasn't been exposed to general everyday sounds and experiences. This is especially important for you as the pup you are getting has gone past several of the important developmental stages- this may not be an issue if the dog has been raised in the house and exposed to all household noises. At 16 weeks your puppy should be wormed and vaccinated and have been out of the house exposed to traffic, children and a wide range of people walking by.

Hopefully, someone will be able to give you a link to all the questions to ask on what the breeder has done with the pup you can ask these things when visiting.

If you go ahead then your pup won't be insured for 14 days after you take out insurance

so does the pup come with insurance or insurance that can be transferred?

The pup should already be microchipped https://www.pets4homes.co.uk/pet-ad...portant-information-for-dog-breeders-on-the-2016-microchipping-regulations.html

Book a vet check for your puppy

then book into a local puppy class ASAP

There are lovely threads on here to support new puppy owners, I know we all seem very negative at the moment but please be assured that it is because we have yours and your future dogs best interests at heart. It's awful to see a dog suffer through bad breeding.

Once you have made your choice there are lots of helpful resources here and helpful people.

 

On what will your cross look like mine looks like one breed most often but the other when she is doing the things most related to that breed.

 

A few years ago I knew a fluffy Cava something or other - I don't remember the exact cross. It was a young rescue with very dedicated owners.

Nice dog, and indeed with a very fluffy coat. It kept having these distressing episodes where it would shake its head, cry and scratch around its neck. It did have some ear infections, as this type of dog tend to do, but even when they seemed to clear this poor dog's episodes continued. The owners had Googled SM and thought it was that.

Eventually it was referred for MRI and they were right: dog had SM, and after treatment was started the episodes decreased dramatically in frequency. They will never stop altogether though, and the dog will be on lifelong medication.

Big shame, and being a rescue dog the owners couldn't have known if the parents were affected or not even if they had been tested (unlikely).

Very fluffy, though.

 

The original question -'what will my puppy look like?' unfortunately doesnt have a definitive answer.
The OP has had additional excellent advice on health testing , insurance etc and been urged to exercise caution in purchasing the pup.
I think everything that needs to said has been ,so on that note I'm closing the thread due to arguments.:Locktopic