[TwoStrings]

Thanks @bcats! Yes, I'm surprised they haven't suggested it too. I'll definitely ask them about it and see if we can get him tested.

Metrobactin is also used as an anti-inflammatory, which is what it was prescribed for in Kubo's case - to calm the inflamed bowel, which worked like a charm (I've got an emergency stash in the cupboard just in case he needs it again!)

Thanks so much for the treat suggestions @Paddypaws! I haven't tried those, so I'll give them a go. Fingers crossed!

 

[chillminx]

@Paddypaws - many thanks for posting the link to the study on novel protein diets (NPD) and hydrolised protein diets (HPD) for cats and dogs. A very interesting read indeed!

I was quite disappointed though to see only the result of one wet NPD for cats being tested, (the rest were all dog foods). The result found for the wet cat food tested was that chicken liver and fish oil had been included in an NPD wet food which had been labelled as just chicken.

In a couple of the HPD wet foods for cats there was found to be soya that was undeclared. But I have never trusted HPD foods to contain what they claim to contain, and I would not use them for any cat I suspect to have food allergies.

From my POV, when using a novel protein diet (NPD) for an elimination diet for a cat, I observe the following rules:

1/ no dry food at all - not even those which claim to be' mono protein' (as one of Macs does) as I can't rely on only a novel protein being in the recipe !

2/ no wet foods that state "meat byproducts" are included - because I fear that could conceal any kind of meat.

3/ no wet foods that contain added fish oil (as fish is not a novel protein).

To meet these criteria I recommend the Catz Finefood Purrr range of novel protein foods, or the Vet Concept foods. I do believe the manufacturers to be, (at least to the best of my knowledge,) transparent about their ingredients.

The Purrrr range does not list 'meat byproducts' as being an ingredient. The only ingredient listed that's not related to the specified animal meat used in the recipe is the added oil, usually borage oil, or rapeseed, which are not traditionally used in cat foods, and are therefore 'new' to the cat.

Vet Concept's novel protein diets do list in their ingredients 'animal by products' but state these are the byproducts of the animal whose meat is used in the recipe. e.g. "Meat and animal byproducts (kangaroo)". "Meat and animal byproducts (reindeer)" etc .

https://www.vet-concept.com/für-die-katze/nassnahrung/katzenmenü-känguru

Vet Concept (unlike the Purrr range) includes a small percentage of vegetables in their recipes (but not soya or pea protein which are used in some ordinary cat food diets)

Fortunately I did not have a problem with either of the above makes when I used them for elimination diets with 3 of my cats. They all however preferred the taste of the Purrrr range instead of the Vet Concept range, so I stuck with Purrr.

If there had been a continued problem with food allergies on the wet food, my next step would have been to buy the raw meat (e.g. kangaroo) and either cook it myself, or serve it raw to them. Using it over an 8 week period for an elimination diet, I would have added taurine and calcium supplements at least.

 

[chillminx]

@TwoStrings - just to mention, that Miamor Ragout Royale wet foods do contain 'meat byproducts' and therefore it is possible that the Salmon and the Turkey flavours contain other meats e.g. chicken. The makers claim their foods are 'beef free' in fact, and do not state their foods are single protein, so really they could contain any meats (except - probably - beef).

I appreciate it is difficult when you've been through so much effort trying to find foods that agree with Kubo, to then start considering further changes to his diet. However, I would myself with my cats want to aim for firm poos "most of the time" if possible, with perhaps only an occasional soft poo.

As far as prebiotics go, my two boys with IBD do not get on with it. One got flatulence when I added it, and the other got diarrhoea.

I do add a very small amount of probiotic to their food every couple of days. If I add more than a very small amount they get diarrhoea. Sometimes I stop adding it for a week, in case I am overdoing it.

Treats - as already mentioned by someone else - I give Thrive or Cosma dried protein treats. I get through quite large amounts of these each month and I wish they weren't so expensive!

 

[KoolK]

Hi all
I honestly do think that snowy has IBD/IBS.. difference?

Basically she has flare ups every so often.. Maybe once a week every month mostly less... where she gets a few days of runny dihorea with blood and sometimes even vomited up her food again

I have been to the vet who gave her metrobactin I think it's called and probiotics. The antibiotic above did help and it went away alongside the use of the probiotic and she was much better but now it's started again!

What causes IBS/IBD?
is it my fault..? Because I kept changing her food when she was younger?? She's 10 months old now.

She's currently on Felix kitten which I know isn't the best... I was thinking of slowly moving her over to animonda VF neutered ...? Does anyone else feed there IBD/IBS cat this ? Or feed their cat in general?

I have tried so many things and I don't know why but every single cat that comes into my care always has some sort if issue... I know this happens and I need to remain calm but I'm a big worrier!

She sometimes can't control the dihorra and begins pooping outside of the litter box EVERYWHERE so I now know that when this happens to keep her in her own one room

What causes her to flare up I don't know... especially this time... nothing has changed in terms of her environment or food and she seems normal as before

What can I do to help her?
Any advice please?

Thanks

 

[bcats]

You

Hi all
I honestly do think that snowy has IBD/IBS.. difference?

Basically she has flare ups every so often.. Maybe once a week every month mostly less... where she gets a few days of runny dihorea with blood and sometimes even vomited up her food again

I have been to the vet who gave her metrobactin I think it's called and probiotics. The antibiotic above did help and it went away alongside the use of the probiotic and she was much better but now it's started again!

What causes IBS/IBD?
is it my fault..? Because I kept changing her food when she was younger?? She's 10 months old now.

She's currently on Felix kitten which I know isn't the best... I was thinking of slowly moving her over to animonda VF neutered ...? Does anyone else feed there IBD/IBS cat this ? Or feed their cat in general?

I have tried so many things and I don't know why but every single cat that comes into my care always has some sort if issue... I know this happens and I need to remain calm but I'm a big worrier!

She sometimes can't control the dihorra and begins pooping outside of the litter box EVERYWHERE so I now know that when this happens to keep her in her own one room

What causes her to flare up I don't know... especially this time... nothing has changed in terms of her environment or food and she seems normal as before

What can I do to help her?
Any advice please?

Thanks

What a worry for you. I have been through exactly the same problem with Poppy. Symptoms very similar but diarrhea not so violent with blood. Has your vet suggested a PCR test ?. This is a test where you send in specimens of the poo to a laboratory. Sounds to me that your cat has an infection. Poppy had a few infections .Giardia, Tritricomonis being two of them. Symptoms are very similar. Poppy was given Metrobactin also Panicure paste which is a wormer but treats giardia. Sometimes it needs two or more treatment. It was the Tritriomonis that we had problems with
Metrobactin does not cure this. Only one treatment for this which is Ronedizole. This is not licenced for cats in UK. Your vet has to have it made up in a laboratory the dose is made up for your cats weight. Many vets do no like prescribing this drug as it has been reported to be neurotoxic. I did have misgivings about giving it to poppy but after a lot of advice from this forum and a group I belong to I decided to give it a go. I consulted a vet who was experienced in treating Tritricomonis and we started the treatment. 21 days of the pills. I watched poppy very carefully for any side effects , there were none. Side effects are usually caused by too higher dose. If there are any side effects the dose has to be stopped immediately. It's now almost four months since Poppys last diarrhea. She does have the very occasional what I call " A bit wet stuff ". I give her VBS clay for that. It's possible in poppys case that the infections have caused damage to her gut so I am very careful what I feed her on. She has Specific digestive support. Fussy madam that's all she will eat. I'm sure you will get some advice from Chillminx on this forum. She has been so supportive very knowledgeable on diet. She will probably advise a single protein food to rule out allergy. The important thing is to get the PCR test done
Expensive around £140 pounds. At least you will then know what you are dealing with. The VBS clay will help the diarrhea and calm the gut. Please feel free to contact me .

 

[TatiLie]

Hi! I haven't been here in a while.

My Ari has IBD and I'm joining the discussion. She's been in treatment for a couple of years already. Prednisone 2.5mg twice weekly, taurine daily, Royal Canin Veterinary food Intestinal. She had a good 4 months with good poo this year but she's in a couple of months of flare-up now. I've become the crazy cat lady that has a powerpoint with poo photos and a poo classification of her daily poos (I've never seen my vet laugh so hard when I told him).

I'm dying to read the 175 pages and see what has worked for you!

 

[TriTri]

Hi! I haven't been here in a while.

My Ari has IBD and I'm joining the discussion. She's been in treatment for a couple of years already. Prednisone 2.5mg twice weekly, taurine daily, Royal Canin Veterinary food Intestinal. She had a good 4 months with good poo this year but she's in a couple of months of flare-up now. I've become the crazy cat lady that has a powerpoint with poo photos and a poo classification of her daily poos (I've never seen my vet laugh so hard when I told him).

I'm dying to read the 175 pages and see what has worked for you!

Hi @TatiLie

Sorry to hear your Ari has IBD and is having a flare up. I have an IBD cat too. Sounds like Ari is on a low dose of steroids, that's something.

You made me laugh with your poo logs, as my Tessytwoshoes has a book where I log her daily output and give it marks out of 100! It's nice to know I'm not the only crazy cat lady out there

How old is your Ari? Any other medical conditions?

Best of luck anyway, Tri Tri.

 

[TatiLie]

Hi @TatiLie

Sorry to hear your Ari has IBD and is having a flare up. I have an IBD cat too. Sounds like Ari is on a low dose of steroids, that's something.

You made me laugh with your poo logs, as my Tessytwoshoes has a book where I log her daily output and give it marks out of 100! It's nice to know I'm not the only crazy cat lady out there

How old is your Ari? Any other medical conditions?

Best of luck anyway, Tri Tri.

Tri Tri, you make me so happy to know that you also log and grade poos! It makes very easy to understand when things are getting better or worse!! Usually, my vet says that he wishes other clients were like me, but when I said "I have a powerpoint with pictures her poos to keep track of her improvement" he just bent over laughing.

Ari is 8-year-old moggy and has always had poos on the soft side, and she's doing very well healthwise apart from this. She's 1kg overweight but the vet is very happy with her overall. She has been tested for other parasites, and had different types of AB therapy, and she's an indoor/catproofed garden only. The first time she had colitis was after spending time in a cattery. She has had ultrasound tests but not a biopsy, and spends in average a couple of nights a year at the vet getting IV fluids. We're still very confused if treatment is working or not. She had been in higher doses which did not improve her poos. The special Royal Canin Veterinary food has also not been consistent with improvement (and as someone who previously fed her grainfree of all available food in zooplus, you can imagine the pain it caused me). The addition of taurine and strict restrictions of treats and other foods helped before but not anymore. Unless she's managing to sneak food from my other cat's feeder (we have Surefeed but she's very eager to pull to tray or push Rocco away when he's eating!). Her flare ups coincide with my school holidays. Anyway, more on my suspicions later as I'm yet to check all the posts on this thread and I want to check if someone has had the same experience

 

[Burmese Boy]

Hello, just want to add my experience, my boy has IBD, and I have posted previously on this site - where I came for help. It took me a long, long, long time to sort Mika out buying up half of Zooplus various brand food (only to be distributed round my friends) to find food that did not pass straight through him.

What has worked for Mika is raw. He has been on this for a number of months now and has solid poo every day. He is thriving and his coat is like silk and shiny. He is no longer on any medication.

It was a leap of faith but my gut instinct always felt it would be right. Chilliminx helped me along the way with invaluable advice. Never feed dried, and a lot of commercial foods contain bad by- products. Cats are carnivores, they can’t process lots of what is in commercial food.

Raw is not for all cats and some won’t touch it, my other one won’t. But it’s worked for me and I get mine from Purrform.

 

[LauraC86]

My 7 year old cat has just been diagnosed with IBD and we have been struggling to get weight on him even though he is eating. We have been feeding him royal canin sensitive food, wet and dry. He doesn't have any diarrhoea, however he was sick yesterday morning. We are going to try the hydrolysed hypoallergenic dry food but I'm.pretty sure he won't be happy without having wet food of some sort. He was on steroids but we stopped giving them to him when he had his biopsy which confirmed IBD and he hasn't been back on them since as he's still recovering. He's got a vets appt today and we are hoping his wound has healed enough so he is OK to have his collar off so he can go outside as I think that's what's frustrating him the most at the moment . Any advice on food etc would be great!

 

[chillminx]

Hi @LauraC86 and welcome

I am sorry to hear about your cat having IBD. I have two 9 yr old cats with IBD (brothers) and fortunately I am able to manage their condition with diet. Neither of them has steroids. One has antacids for short periods if he needs them (this is famotidine).

When my cats first became ill with frequent vomiting (soon after I adopted them when they were 16 mths old) I put them both on exclusion diets to identify which meat proteins they are allergic to (or intolerant of). From this I learnt they are intolerant of beef, fish (except white fish), lamb, venison and rabbit. They also do better on a diet that is low in offal and lowish in fat (it is not unusual in IBD for cats to cope better with lower fat levels in their food).

I feed my cats no dry food because any make of kibble I tried made their symptoms worse. I only ever gave them a little dry food as treats but once I stopped that altogether it helped. Instead I give them the Thrive treats which are freeze dried pure protein.

My cats have a diet of turkey, chicken or duck cat food, along with home cooked low-fat minced pork twice a week, plus fried lambs kidney twice a week and poached white fish once a week. The main part of their diet is Animonda Vom Feinsten for neutered cats, Turkey pure. It is easy for them to digest, and is low in offal and lowish in fats.

https://www.zooplus.co.uk/shop/cats/canned_cat_food_pouches/animonda/trays/523945

Leonardo Pure Poultry canned food :

https://www.zooplus.co.uk/shop/cats/canned_cat_food_pouches/leonardo/wet_food/478464

Concept for Life for sterilised cats :

https://www.zooplus.co.uk/shop/cats...shop/cats/canned_cat_food_pouches/concept_for_life/specialised_nutrition/618401

and Miamor Mild Meals Pure Poultry with Ham :

https://www.zooplus.co.uk/shop/cats/canned_cat_food_pouches/miamor/miamor_trays/42061

Note - some people with IBD cats find the cats do better on a balanced raw diet. I did spend a month trying my cats with raw, (lamb, pork, rabbit, turkey) which they loved, but any of the raw meats made their vomiting much worse, so I had to stop. But I think my cats' reaction may be unusual. There are various online groups which offer support for raw feeding to IBD cats. (See Facebook)

I can't say whether any of the cat foods I've listed above would suit your cat, because every cat with IBD will have their own individual needs. I am only giving you an idea of the kind of foods to look for if you decide to feed a wet food diet (as opposed to a raw diet) .

e.g.
wet food only, or home cooked (or balanced raw) no dry food.
single protein where possible,
containing meat protein, no vegetable protein,
grain free
no added sugars.

 

[JJ-Jedi]

Hi. I’m maybe one of the few people here who hopes their cat does have IBD. Otherwise it’s even more serious. Currently at a loss to do. He’s dying due to malnutrition....

My 10 year old male cat has been losing weight after a few months. He went from 4.3kg to what he is now 3.1kg. He’s just not eating turns his nose up at everything and hasn’t eaten in 5 days now. He’s not drinking much either. 6 days ago he started to get bad diarrhoea, just liquid with blood,which is when he stopped eating. He had a bout of diarrhoea a few months ago, which is when he started to lose weight after. (My other cat had some strange diarrhoea and sickness two weeks before this) He’s now very weak and lethargic. Vets this week have done ultrascan and full external lab blood count and urine test. All are good results. (Although slightly high red blood count which could be bone marrow problem but I also heard diarrhoea can cause this)
It’s most likely a gut problem either IBD or cancer or maybe even some sort of baterial disease or some strange virus. he’s an indoor cat but has been in contact with some feral cats a few months ago. None of them have fiv or feVL. I don’t know what to do. Thinking of getting the vet to put him on an iv for nutrients and then keeping him in for 2-3 days to try build his appetite back up. I feel the fact he has true anorexia is causing him to feel so ill and just sitting under bed all day hiding. Is it worth a go? I’m not sure what other options we have. He’s been sick a few times but not many times. It’s mainly diarrhoea. Vet said ultrascan yesterday showed he has fluid in his gut, but it’s not good as he hasn’t eaten. He’s so thin and weak.
The ultrasound scan showed his organs are all ok currently.

Can’t get a stool sample because it’s just liquid and vet said that’s no good.

He’s had steroid injections and vitamin B and also anti sickness and pain relief. None seem to be improving his condition and bringing his appetite back. He’s just laying under bed all day every day

I know a biopsy can often diagnose cancer but right now I think he’s too weak to go through that.

 

[chillminx]

Hello @JJ-Jedi and welcome

I am sorry to hear your cat is so poorly. I can understand how worrying it must be for you.

When a cat stops eating it can sometimes be really difficult to get them eating again - I have been there with some of my cats (both past and present). It is as though they give up the will to live. The problem is that not eating for 5 days can result in a nasty illness called liver lipidosis, and this is a matter for urgent vet treatment. When did the vet last see him?

It is now very urgent for you to get your cat eating again, if you are to save him. As he has diarrhoea he should be on a diet of home cooked chicken drumsticks or poached white fish, both served with plenty of the cooking juices. Have you tried him with either of those?

For a sick cat who is not eating it is important to stop presenting them with their usual foods. They have started to associate their normal diet with feeling ill, i.e. they blame the food for how they feel.

Instead go now to your nearest pet store or supermarket and buy a selection of about 5 or 6 different wet cat foods. Then put a teaspoonful of each food, one by one, on a plate and set it near him. Do not feed him dry food, wet food only.

Things you can do to encourage him to eat one of the new foods:

1/grind up a couple of cat treats in a new pepper grinder and sprinkle the powder on top of his wet food.
or

2/ sprinkle a little powdered cat nip on top of his food

3/ buy some Thrive freeze dried cat treats in a strong flavour (such as white fish) and break the cubes into pieces and put on his food

4/ liquidise one of the new wet foods in a blender so he can lap it. (don't add water as wet food has a high percentage of water and will become liquid in the blender)

5/ if he won't accept any of the new foods, try him with a little canned tuna for humans - get the one in spring water.

If he is not drinking a lot to compensate for not eating I am very worried he will become dehydrated. He will also need his electrolytes replaced if he is not drinking much or eating anything. Dehydration will make him feel very ill and left untreated will kill him.

Has he had IV fluids at the vet in the past few days? Have a look at his gums - if they are pale and dry looking then he is dehydrated and you need to get him to the vet today. if the gums are moist and pink then he is not dehydrated.

Also you can lift the skin of his scruff between your thumb and forefinger and then let it go. It should spring back almost like elastic. if it stays in a 'tent' position then he is dehydrated.

I would also prepare yourself for force feeding your cat - in case he won't eat any of the new foods you buy for him today.

For force feeding you need to buy a can of Hills Recovery food from the vet. This is highly nutritious and the cat will not need much of it. You also need some food syringes (pharmacies sell them, or the vet may sell you one). The Hills can be used straight from the can, but once the food has been in the fridge it will harden a bit and you may need to warm a small portion in the microwave for 5 seconds to loosen it up a bit. Don't feed it to the cat until you are sure it has cooled down. (Store the Hills in the fridge a plastic food container with a lid or in a small ceramic or glass bowl with a saucer on top. Do not store it in the tin. )

Fill the syringe, then gently squeeze a little food into the corner of your cat's mouth, never into the front of his mouth. Only a small amount at a time and always wait for him to swallow before you give any more, otherwise there is a risk he could aspirate (inhale) the food and it will go into his lungs and cause pneumonia.

Here is a good video showing how it is done :

Please get a can of Hills Recovery food from the vet today and if your cat has refused all the new foods you offer him today then you need to start the force feeding by this evening. Note, that he may not be as docile as the cat in the video, and you will need to be careful not to cause him more stress in his current delicate state. He will need small amounts of food about 3 times a day. You can continue to offer the new foods between the syringe feeds and once he is eating independently stop the force feeding.

Good luck, please let us know how things go. Sending many healing thoughts for your cat's recovery.

 

[chillminx]

@JJ-Jedi - hi, did you get some new foods for your cat to try, and if he refused them, have you managed to start syringe feeding with the Hills Recovery food? I have been worried about him all day.

 

[JJ-Jedi]

Thank you for the in-depth message. I decided to drop him into the vets for the weekend where he will get critical care. I’ve been told I can visit him this afternoon. He will love that and it will lift his spirits.
Monday I’m taking him to the RVCS specialist hospital in potters bar for a biopsy and CT scan if needed. Thank you for your lovely message I will keep you updated

 

[chillminx]

@JJ-Jedi - many thanks for your update. I am relieved you took him to the vet and that he has been admitted for a couple of days. I think it's for the best.

Also pleased to hear he will be seen by the RCVS specialist on Monday. I do hope they can diagnose what is wrong, and it is something treatable. I will be very pleased to hear your update.

EDIT: I meant to say earlier, what a very handsome cat he is. I love LH black and white cats.

 

[RatsnCatnKids]

Hi! I have a 9 year old cat. She had a 'dodgy' tummy on and off for the first few years but nothing much different to any other outdoor cats we've had. It's got worse over the last 4 years or so and she started pooing (diarrhoea) in the house. She wasn't grooming and got very thin. She has 6-monthly vet checks and is much improved on Peridale daily and Royal Canin Sensitive wet and dry food. We feed her in the utility room at night where she has a cat flap. The indoor pooing has stopped and she's gained weight and grooms now. However she still gets muscle spasms whilst she's sleeping and in the last day or so these are now making her moan/harrumph in what I presume is pain. The vet said at the last visit that the only thing left to try is to change her diet again. I swopped the Sensitive dry for Digestive dry as she seems to find this easier to eat as they're thinner.
Any suggestions please? I don't want to keep changing her diet "willy-nilly" (lol) as it affects her so much.
Thank you!

 

[chillminx]

Hi, @RatsnCatnKids - I wouldn't give a cat with digestive problems any dry food at all, but either 100% wet food, or else a balanced raw diet.

Dry foods contain a lot of carbs which are not digested by the cat because they lack the necessary enzyme in their systems. Many dry foods - certainly the Royal Canin ones- contain grains such as maize, wheat, barley etc and some cats are allergic to grains. So dry foods can make a digestive problem worse.

The fact the diarrhoea stopped on a dry food diet is probably due to the fact she's not been drinking enough water to hydrate a dry food diet properly, so by the time the food waste reaches her colon, all the available moisture has been absorbed through the bowel wall for her other organs. On dry food she would need to drink about half a pint of water a day and not many cats do that. The risk is she could develop chronic low level dehydration, which while it may stop the diarrhoea will not be good for her kidneys, bladder and other organs.

There is a possibility she has a food allergy. This can be the case with some cats who have a history of "dodgy tummies". To be certain this is the case you would have to put her on a special elimination diet, which involves feeding her a novel protein diet for 8 weeks, nothing else except water. A "novel protein" is a meat protein she has never eaten e.g. kangaroo, goat, horse, reindeer, venison.

Have her stools ever been tested at the lab for parasites or bacterial infections? To me that would be the first step to take as she is an outdoor cat and could easily have picked up something along the way. Only if her results were normal would I then embark on an elimination diet.

All the foods I mentioned above that could be used as "novel protein" are available online as canned wet food. If you decide to go ahead I can give you the links.

 

[RatsnCatnKids]

Hi! Thank you for your reply. I'll check the composition of the dry food as it's supposed to be specially for cats with bowel problems as recommended by our vet. I think a stool test was done at some point. The biscuits are currently only part of her diet. Originally she was on dry food only but we introduced the wet food a couple of years ago. I will start cutting down on the biscuits now, rather than stopping then suddenly. Thank you again!

 

[Callyq]

I’m so glad this thread exists!

My cat (who is 19/20 years old) has IBD and we’ve just switched to a raw food diet as of yesterday and I’ve got my fingers crossed it works for him. We must have tried EVERYTHING on the zooplus website before settling on to Lily’s kitchen whisker lickin chicken food for a couple of years.

He’s on daily medication of prednicortone but has recently started gaining weight after always losing a bit more at every vet visit so I’m pleased about ☺

I’m looking forward to reading this thread in depth in case there’s anything else I can do to help make Blake more comfortable,