You will need a behaviourist to help deal with this.

It sounds like he is overwhelmed by kids and possibly feels vulnerable. He may have been giving subtle signs that have been missed, so he feels he has to deal with it his way.

Unfortunately, small cute dogs can be a magnet to children.

I wouldn't let any kids near him at all until this has been sorted. Protect him from them

Have a look at Victoria Stilwell's website - it's very helpful in explaining things from the dog's point if view.

 

The mention of the Behaviourist fixing the Guarding issue do you mean resource guarding often over things like treats, food, chews and bones, and sometimes even owners? I notice you mentioned it was a complete success but wondered what methods they used to overcome it, it may or may not have some significance.

With the toddlers and kids and the baby coming it could well be anxiety and stress fuelled behaviour and even fearful. The sights and sounds of a new baby can and does spook and unnerve a lot of dogs causing them to be anxious and even fearful. If a dogs not prepared too and the owners start to make quite big and sudden changes to the dogs routine that can also contribute as the dog can become very confused and that can add to the stress. A stressed, nervous dog can and does become more reactive to things in general too.
Its not uncommon for dogs to become nervous around toddlers and young kids too, as they tend to move fast, be very loud, screech, and can also be clumsy and unstable and trip and fall on dogs, they can too be very heavy handed all be it unintentionally and cap poke and grab and be over zealous. In short they are just at times just unpredictable.

Normally first base if a dog isn't comfortable with a situation is to growl, which is a verbal warning. If something persists then they may show teeth, and even lunge if that's still ignored, you say though that he doesn't give a verbal warning. Which made me wonder how the "guarding" issue was dealt with.
Because if the intitial growl is ignored or dogs are heavily reprimanded for growling then they sometimes don't bother with it and then will go to things like ait snapping, lunging and even nipping if they continue to be pushed.

Another thought that occurred to me too, as you also said he doesn't seem aggressive, doesn't growl and also the fact that he is young too, is that could this be over excitement and the kids are over stimulating him and hyping him up. When kids get over excited, so can dogs in fact they can tend to bounce off each other, if a dog becomes overexcited they can get to a point where they can sometimes jump and nipping and mouthing will start up too. They can get so hyped they cant switch off or calm down without help either.

With kids involved your own and visitors, then ideally I would suggest a behaviourist again. One that can come in and assess him properly in the situations and then take it from there. They can work with you and do follow ups to assess progress too. Again though I would ask what you mean by the guarding issue and what method the trainer used,as to whether you use the same one, because if the wrong methods are used even though they look like they may have solved the problem you can get fall out in other areas.

In the meantime Ive added some links on child and dog safety, and dogs and babies that may help in the meantime. There is also one dogs and fear of children too.

https://positively.com/animal-advocacy/dog-bite-prevention/child-dog-safety-guide/

https://positively.com/articles/dog-child-safetyguide/

https://positively.com/dog-behavior/new-dogs/introducing-a-new-dog/introducing-dog-to-children/

https://positively.com/dog-behavior/behavior-problems/fears-and-phobias/fear-of-children/

https://positively.com/contributors/top-10-tips-for-dogs-and-babies/

https://positively.com/articles/how-to-safely-introduce-your-dog-to-your-new-baby/

https://positively.com/dog-behavior/new-dogs/introducing-a-new-dog/introducing-dog-to-new-baby/

 

Thanks guys. some good points in there, to start off i think we did fail to recognise at first when he was overwhelmed when kids were round. Wrongly we thought lets put him near them so he can get used to them but it was clearly too much too soon and he wasnts slowly intriduced to them in the home.
I think there have been subtle signs but we havent picked up on them. the main one was last year when my gf's dad and grandson were play wrestling in the garden and it freaked freddy out so he yapped at them a bit and lunged but it was mistaken for playing. We didnt quite understand back then.

With the gaurding issue, this came to light when on a few occassions when someone other than myself, my gf or a close family member he is used too would drop an item on the floor. he wouldnt always go to inspect it or pick it up but when another person bent down to get it he would lunge at the hand. he did this a number of times so we got the behaviourist in. He would hide under the table and chew things he had pinched. She gave us a plan starting with him on his bed and putting low value objects near him and treating him as we picked them up, slowly moving it closer upto his paws. This then went onto slightly higher values like dummies etc etc that he would chew on and then moving onto the same but him off his bed. Once complete he then started to be on his bed and walk past him and drop an item near him, again treating when i picked it up and so on. Finally i would drop items near him off his bed and go pick them up with a reward and finally leaving a bag on the floor with high value items in them. In this case i would call him over if he picked it out of the bag and reward him massively if if brought me it or if he just came without it. He completed all this training perfectly and its clear to see everyday that it has worked. he doesnt run off with anything, if anything as soon as i walk over to him he sits and waits for a treat because he now knows dropping and not running off with things is a positive . now we will be using visitors to do the same training from the start.

When i say he isnt aggressive, i mean that he doesnt bark at kids viciously, or dog or strangers. He obviously had an aggressive tendency with the gaurding and also now with kids because the signs he has given us were picked up too late or were not understood. Mostly i think from being overwhelmed in such a short time in the home and now he is associated all kids with one or two days of being frightened or scared. Like you mentioned i believe its a reaction of fear or anxiety rather than an attacking because hes nasty. thinking back i think he has growled at the kids before on an occassion or two but its kind of a really low, not so obvious one.

We both know it is our fault because upto about 17 months old he was great with kids in and out of the house. They could pet him etc and he was fine but the new baby and bit of a routine change (which we have tried to keep exactly the same) and then the gaurding and the kids has maybe become alot to much too soon.

We a really confident that he is happy with his routine still, he gets lots of exercise and his general attitude is happy as always but this last problem being resolved would make him perfect again. i called the behaviourist and she said she needs to see him again to write a correct plan for him and that it will be alot of hard work but its completely possible to re-condition him through + re-enforcement.

I know we can correct it becuase hes very smart and learns quickly. that with good structured training and the right limits i think will be a success. He is an amazing dog and everyone absolutely loves him and i just want him to be safe near kids. i dont expect him to let kids rough him up and stuff but just to be safe for a stroke and to give a treat too etc.

Thanks for the links aswell. i hope i cleared anything up that wasnt clear. Anything else i should consider?

 

The only reason I asked about the method they used to overcome the resource guarding of things and stuff he shouldn't have was because there are still a lot of old style trainers out there that use dominance methods and will do things like taking the item or things away to prove whos boss and to teach them to give it up, which is the absolute worse thing you can do and causes more issues then it solves. These types of trainers do still exist unfortunately we get posts still from people quite often.
That's obviously not the case with the behaviourist trainer you have, who is carrying out the up to date reward/positive methods of dealing with issues and training.
Good that she is coming back to give him a full assessment and then give you a tailor made training plan to help overcome his issues, its exactly the right thing.

Growling is usually a warning that they are not happy and comfortable with a situation, so if he did start that at first, and it was ignored, then what can happen is that as it seems a useless exercise they get to a point where they don't bother which could have happened in his case. Even the most stable good tempered loveliest of dogs can have a limit. Like us they may have days where they are tired and just want a bit of their own space and some peace. Or days where they don't feel great and just want to be left alone. So its always important that a dog has his own space if and when he wants it.

I'm sure she will get you back on track in no time. Meanwhile until then, you are now more aware of things and what he is trying to tell you, and you also have the links on child and dog safety that can help you keep things stable in the meantime to follow.

 

Yes unfortunately i wasnt aware of the old harsh method of training and we did hire one of those, a guy i knew who was ex army dog handler and we saw instant results for heel training and staying on his bed etc but then found out like you have just said so we started from scratch again and now he is amazing at heel, sit, stay, laydown, wait etc etc, all from positive training!! thank god we didnt stick to those old methods or he would be terrible now!!

I completely agree. he has told us he wasnt happy and we didnt resolve it quickly enough. thanks for the links. i will be sure to read up on them.

Although he is great at heel and going to his bed when we say and drop and fetch, is it worth implamenting clicker training?? i hear its really good but dont want to over complicate it by using it for stuff he is already good at. Then again can it be used for positive signs around kids????

 

Yes unfortunately i wasnt aware of the old harsh method of training and we did hire one of those, a guy i knew who was ex army dog handler and we saw instant results for heel training and staying on his bed etc but then found out like you have just said so we started from scratch again and now he is amazing at heel, sit, stay, laydown, wait etc etc, all from positive training!! thank god we didnt stick to those old methods or he would be terrible now!!

I completely agree. he has told us he wasnt happy and we didnt resolve it quickly enough. thanks for the links. i will be sure to read up on them.

Although he is great at heel and going to his bed when we say and drop and fetch, is it worth implamenting clicker training?? i hear its really good but dont want to over complicate it by using it for stuff he is already good at. Then again can it be used for positive signs around kids????

It could certainly well help. Maybe speak to your behaviourist about introducing the clicker and asking her to show you how to do it. Timing can be quite important
when using one, but its well worth discussing with her. Personally I haven't used it with any of my dogs, as they seemed to always be doing well without one, but I know a lot of people use it and swear by it. Its used in all sorts of training not just dogs.

Sadly you fell into the trap purely because people just don't know. The internet is still full of dominance based theory and training too there still remains loads of sites. If you don't know the difference its still a very easy trap to fall into. Thing is too because it appears to work and quickly that's another reason people think its often good. Problem is a lot of dog behaviours although they may look purely aggressive are in fact due to being unconfident and out of anxiousness or stress or fearful behaviour and the displays you are seeing are defensive or fear aggression, so the last thing a dog like this needs is being "dominated"
and handled harshly or punished for bad behaviour.

 

I have a frenchie also and he hates kids and other dogs. He lunges at the, growls and shows his teeth. Recently he started to jump at me and tries to nip my hands. It’s like he is pure evil. What am I to do with this little monster

 

Sometimes, signs of excitement can be mistaken for aggression.

How old is your Frenchie?