Right.. Well at some point in the past 12 hours one of my YBS's has passed away. He managed to get the catch off of the suction pump and got his front left limb caught in it. Obviously.. It was during the night so we were all asleep and my dad came across him this morning. His limbs are all limp and out of the shell and his eyes are glazed over. The limb that was trapped has swollen up. There was briefly some movement however now there is none. I don't want to assume him dead since I know turtles do have a habit of doing this so I am leaving him 12 hours as directed in a box with a towel and a hot water bottle to make sure before we make any decisions. I was just wondering about a few questions of mine if anyone could help me I would be extremely grateful. Firstly He was one of two, i also have a female that is two years older and quite bigger. He was more dominant than her despite size difference, i was wondering if this is likely to have any effect on her? I'm going to keep an eye on her but i do need to know what to look out for if she was to start declining in his absence. Secondly are there any full signs that he is dead and that he is not in shock or anything like that? I would assume he would have had all his limbs and things inside his shell and his eyes would be closed rather than open if he was alive but i'm just not sure. Since we have no idea how long he was under theres also the possibility of him drowning also. We did call the vet who said it honestly was likely he was dead and just to keep an eye on him but i feel horribly guilty about it happening and I just don't know what to do since i have no idea what the chance of him surviving is or how long he was down there. Thanks for any help you can give.