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Treating Sarcoptic mange in Rough Collie

Discussion in 'Dog Health and Nutrition' started by Anniesmum, Jan 18, 2012.


  1. Anniesmum

    Anniesmum PetForums Newbie

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    Hi everyone,

    This is my first posting on a forum so please excuse any mistakes.

    I have a 12yr old Rough Collie called Annie who has recently been diagnosed
    with Sarcoptic mange. She had skin scrapes taken which were negative but
    then an Sarcoptes antibody blood test revealed a positive result.

    My poor girl is in so much discomfort and has been put on antihistamines and has also had antibiotics for a secondary skin infection. My vet has advised using Advocate on her but i am absolutely paranoid about using anything remotely related to Ivomectin due to her being a Collie. I have now had her tested for the MDR1 gene defect and the results came back yesterday that she sadly is affected and has inherited this from both parents.

    I am absolutely desperate now. I would be so grateful if anyone has any experience of using Advocate in a MDR1 -/- collie and if anyone knows of any safe alternatives . All the websites i have looked at advise not to use Mectins in Collies but don't say what you can use instead. Many Thanks
     
  2. Bobbie

    Bobbie PetForums VIP

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    If I was you I would join the Collienet forum as there some very helpful people on there who may have some hepl for you
     
  3. Quinzell

    Quinzell PetForums VIP

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    Anniesmum,

    I'm so sorry for the discomfort that your dog is going through - its horrible, and equally for the anguish that you are going through which is equally horrible.

    My Harvey (Old English Sheepdog) suffers with demodectic mange. He has weekly treatments with Advocate and doesn't suffer any ill effects at all. He used to have Promeris which was really harsh. He would be sleepy for 24 hours after the treatment. I even accidently poisoned a whole tank of seahorses after unwittingly touching him and then putting my hand in the tank.

    OES can carry the same gene (K something?) that can cause the same issues that Ivermectin has with collies. Although, I believe collies are quite a bit more likely to carry this gene.

    My vet didn't warn me about the moxidectin in Advocate, and we have discussed Ivermectin in length. I was quite shocked when I read the ingredients in Advocate (a lesson for all there - read the leaflet before using medication!)

    I wonder if the reason he didn't discuss it is perhaps because the dosage is so low? I keep meaning to discuss it with him but forget. Harvey has been on it for so long now that he obviously isn't effected.

    I will be interested in what others say....
     
  4. Quinzell

    Quinzell PetForums VIP

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    Sorry....forgot to add...

    Tripod helped me tremendously as she has lots of experience with dogs with varying degree's of skin problems. A couple of the things that she advised us to do, which have done wonders, are bath the dog weekly with an anti flea shampoo and then spray with Apple Cider Vinegar.

    We've been doing this for probably a month now and are seeing huge improvements.

    I realise that Harvey's condition (which is exasperated by dermatitis) is quite different to yours but it might be worth contacting her for advice also.

    If this is irrelevant, I do apologise, but I do know what its like to go through something so horrible and sometimes a random comment can make a difference - it did for me :)
     
  5. emmaviolet

    emmaviolet PetForums VIP

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    hi there i am not sure which mange this is.

    my rough collie was 14 and got the type that already lives on the skin as he had cancer and low immune.

    we didnt want any other medication and knew about the mutant gene so did some research and we used lemon juice from fresh lemons and vasaline spread all over the area. the vasaline suffocates the bug but really smother it on twice a day and keep everything clean around the dog.

    i dont know if its the same type though.

    billys cleared up very quickly. but i do believe it may be a different type but i think the vasaline may still kill off the bug.

    sorry coudnt be more help.
     
    #5 emmaviolet, Jan 19, 2012
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2012
  6. Anniesmum

    Anniesmum PetForums Newbie

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    Thank you so much everyone for your kind advice.

    I am beside myself with worry now. I took her back to the vet last night as she doesn't seem at all well in herself plus the fact that she is quite subdued with the antihistamines. Unfortunately my usual vet was not there so had to see another one. He said i should just put the Advocate on as there were no other options. He took her temperature and this was raised so i'm sure that she has a secondary infection going on . My usual vet gave me antibiotics at the weekend when i spoke to her about my fears so at least she is on something.
    I feel our options are running out now because one problem is probably causing the other. It is so hard when you have such a bond with your pet and all you want to do is save their life.

    I have now made an appointment with my usual lady vet for tomorrow. She did say the other day that it might be best if Annie was admitted so that she could be monitered after the Advocate is applied. I am absolutely dreading it but i know that i must do something to relieve her awful discomfort.
     
  7. emmaviolet

    emmaviolet PetForums VIP

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    aww im so sorry you are going through this, the bond is so strong with your dog and the worry is always there.

    can i ask what the mange looks like and where it is?

    you know your dog best so if there is something wrong you know first, explain these things to your regular vet and see if there are any underlying things.

    i hope annie is ok and well soon.
     
  8. Sled dog hotel

    Sled dog hotel PetForums VIP

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    Im pretty certain that stronghold does sarcoptic mange and effectively too, without double checking Im not sure but Im pretty certain that it is different content to Advocate. So that might be worth checking.

    Other treatment that was used before the spot ons did sarcoptic was the
    Aludex that you can still get. Its a bath you have to do them in and let it dry naturally. Not a pleasant job at all by any means, I had to do it years back on my Samoyed but I will say it does work. Again you would have to check if the content is safe for collies though. You just mix it with water and have to soak the skin.
     
  9. Anniesmum

    Anniesmum PetForums Newbie

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    Thanks emmaviolet,

    The irritation started on her front paws,she kept licking them. She then started scratching at her tummy and this became infected. Since June she has been having Hydrotherapy for her poor old back legs and both the vet and i thought that she was having an allergic reaction to the chlorine in the water. It wasn't until we noticed it spreading to the back legs too that we became worried about possible sarcoptic mange. The skin has become red and thickened and scaly and very smelly.
     
  10. Sled dog hotel

    Sled dog hotel PetForums VIP

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    From what I can see but double check to make sure, Stronghold seems to be Selamectin active ingrediant. I managed to find this about selamectin safety
    Safety of selamectin in dogs. [Vet Parasitol. 2000] - PubMed - NCBI

    As far as I can see Aludex is something called Amitraz as far as I can see so far, it says dont use in chihuahuas only no mention of collies.
     
  11. Doolally

    Doolally PetForums Senior

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  12. Sled dog hotel

    Sled dog hotel PetForums VIP

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    Just found this too its the Merck veterinary manual so should be a pretty trusty source. It seems that confirms that amitraz ie Aludex and, Stronghold
    ie selamectin is safe.

    Loads of other stuff about Sarcoptic mange and treatments too, so maybe useful anyway.
    Merck Veterinary Manual
     
  13. Twiggy

    Twiggy PetForums VIP

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    Yes my sister on her collie puppy a couple of months or so ago.

    The vet had no choice. The whole litter went off to their new homes and almost immediately all had fox mange. As all the puppy owners were in contact on one of the obedience websites, they were all eventually treated by their respective vets including the mother.

    My sister's vet said he doesn't have a problem with invomectin and collie types because years ago that is all there was to treat the farm collies. He admitted that they lost one or two but treated hundreds so, in his opinion, the risk was very, very small.

    He also said that he was far more dubious about using invomectin on spaniels.

    HTH
     
  14. Quinzell

    Quinzell PetForums VIP

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    Yes, yes....I forgot about Aludex. Our vets used to give Harvey a weekly bath and it worked really well. The only reason we had to stop was because he started getting open sores in a later outbreak.

    Please please don't give up or feel too down. I went through the same with Harvey. He was miserable. He would sit in one spot, with his head hung low. He had no interest in anything. I remember last year when we had snow, he took himself out into the garden, to one of the very back corners, just lay down and wouldn't come in. My husband had to pick him up and bring him back in. I really thought he was near the end. I honestly didn't know what to do, but slowly, very slowly we started getting on top of things.

    If your vets don't have the Aludex, I'm sure they wouldn't mind phoning around to see if any others have it. Or perhaps they would be understanding if you took him elsewhere for that treatment.

    I have you and Annie in my thoughts.
     
  15. emmaviolet

    emmaviolet PetForums VIP

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    some rough collies have the gene others don't and op dog tested positive for the gene so it is a risk. your sisters dog may not have had it.
     
    #15 emmaviolet, Jan 19, 2012
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2012
  16. Sled dog hotel

    Sled dog hotel PetForums VIP

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    You can get Aludex from on line veterinary pharmacies, you would have to get a prescription and send it with the order. They would charge for the script though. In the catalogue of the company I use its £14.55 per 50ml bottle inc vat post free although you have to pay extra for 1st class post.
    It is concentrate and you dilute with water to make a bath.
     
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