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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Due to people not being able to keep their dogs away from her. We went down the canal path today and she saw 2 of her friends and had a play. She even made a new friend with a lovely dog. He did come bounding over but he stopped a short way away from her. Lovely relaxed posture, not being overly submissive but being submissive enough to show he was not a threat. Frey was given the go ahead to meet after I shouted to his owner to ask if it was okay. They had a good sniff and both moved on.

But further round we came across a dog we had come across before that i know is too over friendly, gets too excited and mouths alot. I turned around and swiftly walked away, hoping to get off the path and into a field before it got to us. No such luck :mad: at first everything was going okay, i even thought that maybe his owner had been working with him (may have even been doing so) until we turned to walk away and it bit frey on the rear. Now he doesnt bite to hurt or be aggresive (i dont think) but he still bites. His owner had carried on walking up the path, totally oblivious to what his dog was doing. Frey turned and snapped back (as any one would) and caught is nose, causing him to squeal. At this point i decided to put him on my lead and take him back to his owner, he ran around to bite freys bum again (as she had flipped round) as i went to get his collar he went to bite frey and bit me instead (didnt draw blood and no bruising but it bloody hurt) I looked up to see his owner running, me thinking to apologies, nope he came to cuss me out for having a nasty dog. I got called a f**cking stupid bitch that needs to keep her nasty little mutt under control and if he sees her out without a muzzle on again he is going to report me to the police. He ran off rather sharpish when i asked for his details as his dog had bitten me and that i will be reporting him to the police. Further round we met up with a regular we see, frey adores her dogs, very few dogs she does adore. As soon as she saw them her hackles went up, she hid behind me. Everytime one of them came to see her she was bearing her teeth. They fortunatly are very well socialised and knew to back off.

Now i am most likely faced with another 6 months to a year of frey being terrified of any dog she sees. She was doing so well and now she has gone back to being scared and worriedly looking out for any approaching dog for the entire walk. I am now seriously considreing getting her a muzzle so she cant actually do any damage. My worst fear has now happened and she is fast becoming what is classed as a DA dog because of this idiot and his dog.

What do i do now?? Not walk my dog offlead at all?? Have my dog muzzled at all times??
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Im so angry about it. She had even intrigated herself into my dads pack of dogs (6 of them), im at my dads now and she is hid under the computer desk, wont go near them and if they walk past her hackles go up. Going to take her home in a minute. I just dont know what to do. I want to keep working with her, but now im worried she may actually damage a dog that approaches her. Do i muzzle her to maybe get the point across that she isnt 100% friendly and protect her and myself?? Or is that going to make things worse?? Im so confused at what to do :(
 

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Definitely not to muzzle.

Your dog cannot handle social encounters and has made this obvious. Muzzling him will not give him confidenece or improve this, it will merely stop him biting.

Dogs with poor social skills are also unable to read dogs am therefore become a target.

If I walked in areas like you then I would have the same problem.

Instead I walk with a group of on lead dogs and not around OFF lead dogs.

Your dogs is a DINOS and therefore needs space.

Please do not muzzle him. Puts him at a big disadvantage and will very likely end in him getting attacked.

Avoid the problem and take the pressure off
 

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Another thought. :idea:

We quite often use Muddy as a buffer dog between Alfie and a fast approaching large dog.

Is there anyone you could walk with regularly that has a dog that can cope?
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
I live in the middle of a city, parks and fields always have dogs on them. she can handle social situations, when the other dog is polite, she just doesnt appreciate being mithered. I am worrying that she will end up doing some damage if pushed to hard. The only dogs we can walk with are sky and bella. But she is showing signs of not wanting to interact with them either :(
 

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I know you don't want her to bite, but in my opinion, her reaction to being nipped by this other dog was totally justified!

Harley would have done exactly the same thing, and although he wouldn't escalate it, if the owner had a go at me, I'd tell them that their dog was the one in the wrong, and mine was just telling it to sod off!

I used to (and still occasionally do) take Harley to a really specific park to do intense socialisation with him (it's full of dogs, but more importantly, the owners are REALLY relaxed and are willing to help socialise). I muzzle him (he's a snapper when he wants dogs to give him space), and let him sniff greet (obviously with other owners permission). I took him one time, and approached a man with a Dobe, Dal and Boxer x, and asked if they were friendly and if Harls could say hi and have an offlead run with them. He agreed and said his dogs were friendly. As soon as I unclipped Harley, the Dobe and Dal ran after him biting him - Harley ran SO far away trying to lose them, then eventually (after a greyhound joined in the "fun" and nipping at his bum too) came back to me where he hid behind my legs whilst I hoisted (and got bit in the process) the Dobe from biting him (he wasn't trying to attack Harley so to say, but he certainly wasn't being friendly!). Now if Harley had not been muzzled, he could have helped defend himself. The other dogs' owner then informed me his Dobe did that to another muzzled dog a couple of weeks prior! I felt guilty about having him muzzled then!

I'm much more reluctant to muzzle him now. Instead, I just make sure he has a headcollar on, so I can control his mouth, but he has full use if needed.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I know you don't want her to bite, but in my opinion, her reaction to being nipped by this other dog was totally justified!

Harley would have done exactly the same thing, and although he wouldn't escalate it, if the owner had a go at me, I'd tell them that their dog was the one in the wrong, and mine was just telling it to sod off!

I used to (and still occasionally do) take Harley to a really specific park to do intense socialisation with him (it's full of dogs, but more importantly, the owners are REALLY relaxed and are willing to help socialise). I muzzle him (he's a snapper when he wants dogs to give him space), and let him sniff greet (obviously with other owners permission). I took him one time, and approached a man with a Dobe, Dal and Boxer x, and asked if they were friendly and if Harls could say hi and have an offlead run with them. He agreed and said his dogs were friendly. As soon as I unclipped Harley, the Dobe and Dal ran after him biting him - Harley ran SO far away trying to lose them, then eventually (after a greyhound joined in the "fun" and nipping at his bum too) came back to me where he hid behind my legs whilst I hoisted (and got bit in the process) the Dobe from biting him (he wasn't trying to attack Harley so to say, but he certainly wasn't being friendly!). Now if Harley had not been muzzled, he could have helped defend himself. The other dogs' owner then informed me his Dobe did that to another muzzled dog a couple of weeks prior! I felt guilty about having him muzzled then!

I'm much more reluctant to muzzle him now. Instead, I just make sure he has a headcollar on, so I can control his mouth, but he has full use if needed.
She was most definatly justified at snapping at this dog, he is a little shite and chased a friend of mines dog for blooming miles once. This is why i am in 2 minds. She will never approach another dog, she usually ignores them when they approach her (when they arent biting her bottom) which is why i walk her off lead. I just feel awful that her freedom on a walk is going to be restricted either by always being on her lead or by being muzzled because other people cant (sometimes dont even seem to want to) control their animals. I want it to be nipped in the bud so it doesnt progress any further :(
 

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She was most definatly justified at snapping at this dog, he is a little shite and chased a friend of mines dog for blooming miles once. This is why i am in 2 minds. She will never approach another dog, she usually ignores them when they approach her (when they arent biting her bottom) which is why i walk her off lead. I just feel awful that her freedom on a walk is going to be restricted either by always being on her lead or by being muzzled because other people cant (sometimes dont even seem to want to) control their animals. I want it to be nipped in the bud so it doesnt progress any further :(
If Frey was my dog and acted as you've just described, I wouldn't muzzle her personally.

If she was just attacking willy nilly, and approached dogs to bite them, then yes, but for defending her space, most definately not.

If the other dogs' owner has a problem with your dog trying to teach theirs some manners, then they shouldn't let them charge up to other dogs.

My two will sometimes run over to another dog (it's rare, but if I don't spot them or am too slow for whatever reason), BUT if the other dog told them where to go, I would be apologising for not having the correct control over my dogs (although my dogs back off when told).
 

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If you have a dog that doesn't cope well with close encounters with other dogs, walking on a narrow canalside path where head-to-head meetings with other dogs are likely is really not a good idea. You need to keep to open spaces where there's somewhere to go to avoid other dogs' unwanted attention.

If she bit in self-defence, I wouldn't muzzle at this stage - though it might be wise to get a muzzle and start getting her used to wearing it. Then if it really becomes necessary, you can use it straight away.
 

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The only reason I muzzled Rupert was because he had no bite inhibition and if he went in for the attack he went in to do serious harm and would not stop until forcibly removed.

I wouldn't muzzle Frey personally. She's not running off to attack other dogs and by the sounds of it nor is she going in like Rupert did but is just doing enough to tell the other dog where to go.

I'm sorry you keep encountering dogs who cause you problems. I had the same issue with Rupert and know just how frustrating and upsetting it is. You go to all the trouble of trying to socialise them only for something like this to happen and undo all the work you've put in.
 

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I wouldnt muzzle her if she is just trying to defend herself TBH. Isnt there anywhere you can walk without out of control dogs??:confused: I know round my way a good solution would be to go to the parks that are open onto the road and walk my dog on lead around the edge. Owners of rude dogs usually keep away from these bits as they cant keep their dogs off the roads!:rolleyes:
 

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I don't know what your area is like but I live in greater London and people seem to walk their dogs at specific times around here early - 6ish the school run 8-10 and 2-4 and early evening about 6 I find that round my way you can go out about 8pm and maybe bump into 1 or 2 dogs if that. Another thing is perhaps walk in smaller parks, this may sound a little strange but all the small parks near me (usually rugby fields) people hardly ever walk their dogs there only at these kind of times. Another thing you could try is walking at non popular times in farmers fields (with no animals) I've never bumped into dogs on those routes. If you want to keep her on lead try perhaps a children's park, we have quite a few near us that have a kiddy area and all the kids stay there but the dog walkers walk in different areas and it's pretty strict on lead only. You could also look into walking in university/school fields my nans friends garden door leads into one and she's allowed to walk there weekends and between 6pm and 7am week days. Perhaps ask any local trainers if they have grounds that don't have a lot of off lead dogs that they may use for training. I know rules are different in different places so I would definitely talk to someone local to ask about places, perhaps drive a little way? I wouldn't muzzle until I absolutely had too. Tbh that incident this morning definitely sounds like the other owners fault. I wouldn't react well to being but on the bum either. I'm sorry your dog had to go through that, sending her my best <3. Whether she likes dogs or not the other owner should learn to control their dog and keep a close eye. My neighbour had a dog that was good as gold loved dogs gave them kisses made friends one day this dog was over friendly really wouldn't quit despite her trying to get the dog to go away as they wanted to finish their walk but the dog kept nipping at him, my neighbours dog did a little growl to get the dog to go away, it reacted by pinning my neighbours dog down and biting him. The owner did nothing but said its because he's young but he was a big breed and my neighbours dog was never the same again. People ought not to have dogs if they can't control them, it only takes a couple of seconds to either put your dog on the lead or change direction. A little bit of consideration these days would be nice :/ hope you find a solution :)
 

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I really feel for you because you were doing everything you should with your dog. Isn't it always the way though, quite often those with dogs who they know can be "funny" / uncomfortable around others seem to do their ultimate to have control where as so many with "friendlies" let them run and jump and pester everyone / every where!

I personally, if doesn't upset frey, would have her muzzled. I know it's heartbreaking because really, it isn't her fault or yours.

But atleast this way you will both be protected, and she can't lash out or cause damage with her teeth if she does become frightened - therefore no idiots like the one you met can threaten you.

I for one know it isn't always possible to walk where there aren't other dogs. I try to avoid them often with some of the dogs I walk, and there's always one, and it's usually one of the "friendlies" I mentioned that doesn't back off and the owner just doesnt care or is ignorant to the damage their "friendly" dog is actually doing.

But if you could find a group of dogs Frey does (or did) like and feel comfortable with, and walk with them (preferably on lead), she will eventually relax and gain confidence slowly. It will take a while, always does sadly. One bad experience needs many good experiences to counter it out. Hopefully she was just stressed from the day / event and that is why she got upset with the other dogs you know, and may feel a little better the next time you go out.

Good luck, I understand how you feel as many others do im sure.
 
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