UK Pet Forums Forum banner
  • Please post in our Community Feedback thread for help with the new forum software! If you are having trouble logging in, please Contact Us for assistance.

1 - 20 of 22 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,562 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I can't get my pup to 'stay'. she will do sit and down but as soon as I take one step back, she follows. OH has (reluctantly) helped out by holding her on a lead while I step away but she is just straining to get to me. She is 7 months. Any ideas?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,536 Posts
Try taking a very small step to the side, then immediately move back to the dog. Gradually make the step a little bigger, and increase the time before you return. Literally just one second to start.
If she really can't do that, then just move one leg to the side.
If you build it up very slowly, she will get the idea.

Try not to restrain her as she needs to work it out for herself.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
15,185 Posts
Why are you stepping away from her at all?

How long do you want her to "stay" for?

Will your dog stay by your side without moving for that length of time no matter what the distraction?

If not, it is too early to move away.

Stays have 4 components

Duration
Distraction
Distance
Difficulty

And they should be taught in that order.

An excellent book on STAY training is Teach Your dog to Want to Stay by Anne Bussey MSc a behaviourist and very succcessful dog trainer, competitor and judge.

Welcome to Working Trials Monthly
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,562 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Why are you stepping away from her at all?

How long do you want her to "stay" for?

Will your dog stay by your side without moving for that length of time no matter what the distraction?

If not, it is too early to move away.

Welcome to Working Trials Monthly
Now I do feel a twit! :laugh: And the answer is No, she won't stay for any length of time. It really didn't occur to me to stand by her while she stays! (In case this is sounding sarcastic I don't mean it to- It really hadn't occured to me!) Thanks I will start trying to get a stay standing next to her first!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,602 Posts
You train it on lead.
Stand beside the dog, her in a sit.
Step to the side, step back, reward the dog.
Repeat - if she remains in a Sit, add the command word, Stay.
Build up till she gets it.
Do it in different places, and with you in different positions.
If she moves, go back to Step One. :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,420 Posts
Might be easier to teach it with a clicker if you haven't tried already. Click and treat first to get good associations with the clicker, and then build up a stay by your side first -
get her into position, and say your command 'stay' or whatever
when she sits still for a period of time say few seconds, click and treat.
Eventually build up the time between the command and the click so she starts to understand the stay command.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
15,290 Posts
I taught it off leash with both Spen and Rupert but didn't teach it separately from the sit/down. I started by clicking the instant they sat/lay down on command and then once they were reliable with that waited a second before clicking and then 2 seconds, then 3 and so on.

Smokeybear, any reason distraction should be taught before distance? Just out of curiosity.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,562 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Might be easier to teach it with a clicker if you haven't tried already. Click and treat first to get good associations with the clicker, and then build up a stay by your side first -
get her into position, and say your command 'stay' or whatever
when she sits still for a period of time say few seconds, click and treat.
Eventually build up the time between the command and the click so she starts to understand the stay command.
I haven't tried clicker training yet. I do plan to at some point. I am terribly unco-ordinated so will have to practise before I start with the dogs!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
212 Posts
My Maggs for example is all about body language, so when we do "stay" I keep my finger raised and my arm stretched out, while I am walking away and walking back. Might be worth trying it with your dog, to find out if she will rather concentrate if you combine a voice command with a sign.
I also taught it off lead, first in the garden. In the very beginning I d make a small step back leaning my body still quite a bit towards her, so she won't follow... then just keep building up from it, moving your body away as well and making a bigger step.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,762 Posts
If she isnt ready for a full step, try just a gentle movement, or a foot shuffle, we were taught stay to move round them in a clock face and to not increase round or further away until they would stay with you going behind them.

Only moving to the next step or incline toward a step when they were reliable at the previous. This was clicker reinforced.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,966 Posts
I prefer to think of it as teaching a stable position, be it a sit, down or stand.
As SB has already said until you have the stability with you standing there I wouldn't move.

I would not introduce any extra commands or signals, they only have to be got rid of later.

When I had a stable position next to the dog for a reasonable time probably at least 60 seconds, without extra commands or signals, I would think about moving.

My first movement would be a small one, leg furthest away from the dog put out in front, put back in position, dog rewarded in the sit.

Watch the dog closely and look for signs the dog is thinking about movement, a shift in body weight forward signifies the dog may get up, if so start again.

Then gradually build up, time distance and distraction.

Above all if you or the dog get it wrong, don't worry, repeat and get it right, lots of stay issues are caused by anxious owners or dogs.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
15,185 Posts
Now I do feel a twit! :laugh: And the answer is No, she won't stay for any length of time. It really didn't occur to me to stand by her while she stays! (In case this is sounding sarcastic I don't mean it to- It really hadn't occured to me!) Thanks I will start trying to get a stay standing next to her first!
Don't feel a twit, stay training is by and large extremely poorly trained with trainers/owners confusing position with distance.

Remember in training only one variable should be trained at a time to make it easy for the dog to understand and maximise the chances of success.

So if your object is say a 5 minute down stay, then you must obtain that next to you first.

Then, start introducing distractions by clapping, jumping whistling, etc and then introduce external distractions but go back to the beginning ie only ask for a few seconds and build up as before.

Once you have achieved this then you go back to the beginning again and introduce distance by moving away.

Finally difficulty is when you go out of sight, with loads of distractions for a long time.

Good luck! :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14,451 Posts
I taught it off leash with both Spen and Rupert but didn't teach it separately from the sit/down. I started by clicking the instant they sat/lay down on command and then once they were reliable with that waited a second before clicking and then 2 seconds, then 3 and so on.

Smokeybear, any reason distraction should be taught before distance? Just out of curiosity.
Mainly because you are in the right place to reinforce the stay, whereas if you were the other end of a training hall, for instance, the dog would probably have forgotten what you were asking him to do by the time you got there.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
21,573 Posts
Will probably get a black mark from my ex trainer, but I use an open palm towards the dog for a sit/stay, as well as a whistle command, which is a long slow peeeeeep. I train a sit at heel which is also a stay or stop, and work on building up distance and off lead sit/stops once the pup has got the hang of it on lead. If I use a verbal command it's just 'sit', I don't have a stay command.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,966 Posts
Will probably get a black mark from my ex trainer, but I use an open palm towards the dog for a sit/stay, as well as a whistle command, which is a long slow peeeeeep. I train a sit at heel which is also a stay or stop, and work on building up distance and off lead sit/stops once the pup has got the hang of it on lead. If I use a verbal command it's just 'sit', I don't have a stay command.
Yes, where is my pen, I suppose it depends on your end goal, as mine are out of sight stays I don't want extra command or signals, I don't use the word stay either, just sit, stand or down.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
15,185 Posts
Wll I do not need to give my dog THREE simultaneous signals to sit.

If my dog is next to me and within hearing distance, my voice is sufficient.

If the dog is far away then a whistle is efficient.

If you were doing say film work, then a hand signal is the most appropriate.
 
1 - 20 of 22 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top