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So the DUP are now controlling our future.

Discussion in 'General Chat' started by noushka05, Dec 5, 2017.


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  1. noushka05

    noushka05 Unicorn denier. Snowflake. Activist ;)

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    The UK govt is being held to ransom by a bunch of far right extremists. Everyday brings a new brexit nightmare . What a shambles :/


    This >>
    Has anyone pointed out the irony that Theresa May would have given in on all three EU demands if it wasn’t for a party representing minority of voters in territory that voted remain?


    Hard Brexiters have just discovered Britain is weaker than Ireland

    https://www.theguardian.com/comment...it-talks-irish-border-lesson?CMP=share_btn_tw

    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]
     
  2. stockwellcat.

    stockwellcat. About to start a new beginning.

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    Please explain to me why should Northern Ireland remain in the Customs Union or single market when the rest of the UK has left it? Thersea May said the UK (that includes Northern Ireland) would be leaving the Customs Union and single market and no part of the UK would remain in the Customs Union or Single Market.

    There is still time to get an agreement for phase 1 of the talks before the 14th December 2017.
     
    #2 stockwellcat., Dec 5, 2017
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2017
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  3. Satori

    Satori One of Life's Winners.

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    Yes the irony is rather glaring. The DUP was still correct in in defending the constitutional position of NI though and rejecting May's concessions that ran roughshod over the Good Friday agreement. She knew the DUP would have to reject that deal and the EU knew it too. It's all smoke and mirrors.
     
  4. KittenKong

    KittenKong PetForums VIP

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    The answer to that seems simple.
    If May vowed to keep the entire UK in the single market and customs union, remembering the question of leaving them was not asked on the referendum paper, it's the only way to avoid a hard border with the Irish Republic.

    This might sound odd but as much as I disagree with the DUP I give them credit for standing up to May the way they did.

    Seeing their point of view they don't want to be treated differently from the rest of the UK. Why should May decide on their future without their say so? Ditto with Scotland.
     
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  5. stockwellcat.

    stockwellcat. About to start a new beginning.

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    That maybe a simple solution for those that voted remain but to be totally frank I think the way this will play out is that there is going to be no deal.

    Here is something for you to stew on. Perhaps what happened yesterday was just a show, a performance. Here's why, Arelene Foster would have been consulted way in advance what Theresa May was going to offer yesterday to the EU and it was probably decided by TM and AF to do what happened so they can achieve a hard Brexit, a no deal scenario with the EU because of the hardline the Republic of Ireland's PM has taken with Northern Ireland's border with them. This may have been the plan with what happened yesterday.

    Brexit isn't going to be stopped, it will happen in one of two ways, with a deal or without a deal. The deal scenario of Brexit is quickly fading away unless a miracle happens in the next few days.
     
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  6. KittenKong

    KittenKong PetForums VIP

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    I think we are aware of that.
    The option to remain in the customs union and single market would be a good start. Look at countries like Norway (not in the Customs Union though) and Switzerland for example.
    You don't have to be in the EU to be part of these.

    I think the government better hurry up and find contractors to build the NI/EU border wall and enlarge or build Customs units to cope with the massively increased demand, remembering UK citizens will now be subjected to customs checks whether returning from a day trip to France or from a far away place. Something many who voted for Brexit didn't think would happen.

    Surely the lack of "progress" in these areas would be a concern of the hardest of Brexiteers I would have thought.
     
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  7. stockwellcat.

    stockwellcat. About to start a new beginning.

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    You don't need a wall to have a border. You are thinking of the most extreme scenario there.

    You're wrong because there has been significant progress on all 3 areas the EU want dealing with in the last couple of weeks. The issue yesterday was because the EU want Northern Ireland (Not Scotland, Wales, England or Gibraltar) to remain in the Customs Union and Single Market and the DUP quite rightly said that Northern Ireland is leaving the EU with the rest of the UK and wants no special arrangements to remain in the EU.

    So you'll have to show your passport coming back into the UK. You have to do this anyway when returning to the UK from abroad. EU Citizens from countries outside the UK will get checked more than UK citizens.
     
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  8. KittenKong

    KittenKong PetForums VIP

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    Yes of course UK citizens have their passports checked like everyone else on their return. They don't currently have to go through the Customs channels in addition to this when returning from other EU countries but will do post March 2019.

    My point is what are the government going to do about that? Been very little progress so far so they'll be chaos in the airports if they don't get a move on.

    Perhaps a wall between NI and the EU sounds a little extreme but the border will have to be staffed of course.
     
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  9. kimthecat

    kimthecat PetForums VIP

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    @stockwell I thought you weren't going to do any more Brexit threads :)

    No fighting, you two , or I'll make you sit on the naughty step . :D
     
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  10. stockwellcat.

    stockwellcat. About to start a new beginning.

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    No fighting here.
    Quite a friendly conversation :)
     
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  11. kimthecat

    kimthecat PetForums VIP

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    So far :D
     
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  12. stockwellcat.

    stockwellcat. About to start a new beginning.

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    It will stay that way from me :D
     
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  13. Dr Pepper

    Dr Pepper Banned

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    The Ireland border is as much a issue that needs resolving for the EU as it does for the UK. In fact it’s a bigger issue for the EU as we already have a commitment to no hard border.
     
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  14. Arnie83

    Arnie83 PetForums VIP

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    What Ireland (not the EU, except that they back Ireland) want is simply to have no border on the island of Ireland, because then people with guns start emerging from the shadows.

    How that is achieved is up to the UK to propose. and reasonably so since it is the UK who have chosen to leave the EU and cause the problem.

    It would have been better had the Tory Brexiteers thought of a feasible solution before triggering Article 50. The blame for this mess lies entirely at their door.
     
  15. stockwellcat.

    stockwellcat. About to start a new beginning.

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    Deleted.
     
    #15 stockwellcat., Dec 5, 2017
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2017
  16. Zaros

    Zaros Pet Forums, P/resident Evil

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    It's a mania with him. An obsession if you like. Some have an incurable fascination with fire, others stealing.

    I have Dipsomania (this is nothing to do with holding a teletubby for ransom)

    Stocky has Breximania.;)
     
  17. kimthecat

    kimthecat PetForums VIP

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    @Zaros :eek: I think its catching !

    I'm sat here with my popcorn waiting for the fireworks . :D

    Seriously though , Its just one big mess .
     
    #17 kimthecat, Dec 5, 2017
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2017
  18. Arnie83

    Arnie83 PetForums VIP

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    David Davis has told the Commons that when they said yesterday that there would be convergence of regulations between Northern Ireland and Ireland, they actually meant the whole of the UK and the EU.

    Not sure why May didn't just say that to the DUP on the phone, unless - shock, horror - Davis was telling porkies.

    “The presumption of the discussion was that everything we talked about applied to the whole United Kingdom. Alignment isn’t harmonisation. It isn’t having exactly the same rules. It is sometimes having mutually recognised rules, mutually recognised inspection – that is what we are aiming at.”​

    In other words, the EU sets the rules, and the UK takes a sovereign decision to abide by them.

    Everybody happy.
     
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  19. stockwellcat.

    stockwellcat. About to start a new beginning.

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    So does every UK media channel at the moment :) It's a bit hard to ignore to be honest.
     
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  20. stockwellcat.

    stockwellcat. About to start a new beginning.

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    Enjoy the popcorn :D
    It's actually going quite well if you believe a hard brexit is inevitable. :D If this does happen then one would question why it has taken so long.
     
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