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Just how essential is bone in a raw diet?

Discussion in 'Dog Health and Nutrition' started by DirtyGertie, Oct 3, 2013.


  1. DirtyGertie

    DirtyGertie PetForums VIP

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    Not intending this to turn into another pro raw/anti raw/pro commercial/anti commercial thread, I just really want to know how much bone is essential in a raw diet.

    Reading some threads over time I've noticed that some dogs get a big percentage of bone and others get much less than even the 10% recommended. Obviously it depends on the individual dog and at what point the amount of bone would cause constipation (or other problems), but is there a minimum percentage that ought to be bone?

    Putting aside the dental health aspects of raw bones would there be any detrimental effect of not having bones in a raw diet (not even feeding minces which are supposed to be 80:10:10 but just meat and offal).

    If any vital nutrient would be missing by not feeding bone, what could replace it?
     
  2. Linda2147

    Linda2147 PetForums Senior

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    I am a raw feeder, bone or bone meal in the food is necessary for good poop. Not enough bone will make poop very soft and runny, to much will make it hard. If you are not feeding raw and the poop is still soft then add some powdered bone meal. Make sure its for animals, they do sell another bone meal for plants.

    Its a trial and error thing, you will need to adjust the amount to the dog's need

    Also be sure to give a probiotic. Probiotics keep the gut healthy and 80% of a dogs health originates in the gut.

    uncooked bones are fine for a dog, its cooking that makes them brittle
     
  3. DirtyGertie

    DirtyGertie PetForums VIP

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    Thanks Linda. I am a raw feeder anyway :). However, commercially fed dogs can get good poops (not necessarily as firm as a raw fed dog but certainly not always very soft and runny) and there'd be no bone in their diet so that's one of the reasons for my question.
     
  4. Linda2147

    Linda2147 PetForums Senior

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    who knows whats in commercial food? All that junk and poisons thats killing dogs, who knows what they are eating.

    I'm in the USA, don't know where you are but there is a big thing about "rendered meat" in the food. Rendered meat is euthanized dogs and cats ground up with collars and all mixed with the commercial dog foods. Nothing I'd feed my dogs.

    I even make my own treats, using beef heart, chicken breast and pork loin. If you are interested I can tell you how I make them. Nothing added just meat and dogs go crazy over them
     
  5. Mumtomaddog

    Mumtomaddog PetForums VIP

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    OMGosh!!... Really? :eek: In all honesty i'd never heard that before, i'm gobsmacked!

    I would love to have a recipe for your treats though, if thats ok, please? :) Max would be ever so grateful too. :w00t:
     
  6. Linda2147

    Linda2147 PetForums Senior

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    I am sending you this link about rendered meat. There is also a showing of it on utube

    Rendered products in dog food - What's your dog really eating?

    The treats are really so simple to make and I've never seen a dog turn one down.

    Seems all I do is make treats, I do sixty pounds at a time, I have my shepherd, my daughter has 4 bulldogs and a friend has a shepherd so to keep them all supplied I have to make plenty

    Anyway, here is how I make them. first thing is to get off all the skin and as much fat as possible

    cut into thin strips, no more than a half inch thick, After slicing I let them drain in a colander for several hours to get out as much moisture as possible.

    Put in a food dehydrator (a table top model if fine) I have a commercial one with 27 trays. Turn on dehydrator and let them "cook" they are done when they no longer look shiny and you can move them around on the trays without sticking. With a tabletop model it will be about 13 hours.

    Then come out nice and crunchy and the dogs love them, crunchy and good for the teeth and no additives. They will keep forever but they won't last that long.

    Let me know how you make out with them
     
  7. Mumtomaddog

    Mumtomaddog PetForums VIP

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    Thanks very much for the link, will definitely have a look at it.

    Many thanks for the treat recipe, i dont have a dehydrator... i might have to have a look round for one. I guess just a very low oven wouldnt suffice?

    Thanks again, i really appreciate this. Will definitely let you know what Max thinks :smile5:
     
  8. Linda2147

    Linda2147 PetForums Senior

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    I think if you set the oven really low at about 140 it would probably work but I have no idea how long it would take, never tried it.

    What you want to do is take all the moisture and liquid out of the meat so it would probably work.

    Let me know how it goes for you
     
  9. PennyGSD

    PennyGSD PetForums Senior

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    I'm no expert although I've done a reasonable amount of research into raw, but I believe bone provides calcium, which is actually what helps to firm them up.

    Egg shell is a good source of calcium, but I'd suggest reading extensively around the subject. There are a number of really good links in the Raw Feeding thread.
     
  10. DirtyGertie

    DirtyGertie PetForums VIP

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    PLEASE I did say in my original post that I don't want this to turn into another pro raw/anti raw/pro commercial/anti commercial thread, there's already one recent thread that's degenerated into that.

    I haven't done any real research into commercial food but I'm sure I've read that although there may be euthanised animals etc in food in the US that does not happen here in the UK.
     
  11. Linda2147

    Linda2147 PetForums Senior

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    I am not either for or against raw or commercial feeding. Its an individual choice. I just said I feed raw, Just saying in my own experience!
     
  12. pogo

    pogo PetForums VIP

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    Bone in some form is essential as well as keeping poo the best consistency but it provides calcium but along with feeding meat and bone, help balance the calcium : phosphorus ratio
     
  13. babycham2002

    babycham2002 PetForums VIP

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    I thought that bone provided
    calcium, phosphorous, magnesium, copper and other minerals

    I also thought I read somewhere it was a good source of glucosamine and chondriton but I would have to go and double check

    I raw feed an elderly dog with only one tooth and make sure she gets her bone in bone in minces
    She will have a crack at actual bones but just doesnt have the tools for them bless her
     
  14. pogo

    pogo PetForums VIP

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    yes theres plenty of goodies in bones.

    Also bones from different animals provide slightly different amount of nutrients, and the joints and cartilage do provide glucosamine such as chicken feet :)
     
  15. babycham2002

    babycham2002 PetForums VIP

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    Ah lovely thank you, thought I had got that from somewhere.

    At first I was worried about feeding Tallulah when she cant have whole bones but I think her current condition compared to previous speaks essays for the fact that its working
     
  16. DirtyGertie

    DirtyGertie PetForums VIP

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    So say you've got a dog that can't tolerate much bone (because of it causing constipation) and you know it will be a lot less than the normal 10%, how low would you be able to go without resorting to bone-in minces? Or would you add a supplement to supply the nutrients that you'd be low on if feeding minimal amount of bone?
     
  17. Linda2147

    Linda2147 PetForums Senior

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    you can mix 1 tablespoon of "missing link" that provides all the vitamins and minerals that might be missing in the diet. Plus it gives them a nice shiny soft coat
     
  18. DirtyGertie

    DirtyGertie PetForums VIP

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  19. Linda2147

    Linda2147 PetForums Senior

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    I use the one for joint and I also give a vitamin. If you have a powerful meat chopper you can grind the meat with the bone, just not use as much bone if your dog has an issue with it. like start off small maybe 4% bone and if its well tolerated you can add more or less depending on reaction to it
     
  20. dandogman

    dandogman PetForums VIP

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    This is not the case in the UK, just for the benefit of anyone reading this post and believing it's the same here - Legislation Governing Pet Food - PFMA
     
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