[Spendy]

Hi everyone, I recently took Karma to a friend's house. There was another lady there visiting and we got into a bit of a debate about Karma ... turns out this lady is a "self proclaimed dog breed specialist"

Anyway, she said that Karma was most certainly not a miniature pinscher, but a English Toy Terrier. I think it only got a bit heated as I just brushed it off and the fact that I didn't care if someone told me she was a great dane, I'd love her the same and wouldn't do a thing about it (aside from perhaps get a bigger bed ). She said it was obvious due to the shape of her head and also the black markings down her legs which MinPins don't have.

But when I got home, I let curiosity get the better of me and I did a bit of googling. See, about a month after I got Karma, someone who knows the lady I got her from said she heard she was dodgy probably wasn't on the level with me. I know I paid over the odds for her and she's not KC reg, but I didn't see the point of speaking to the lady as I love this dog to pieces and she's my family now.

As I said before, I could care less about her breed, but it would be nice to know either way.

Anyone have any experience on either breed that could shed some light?

 

[Lil Doglets]

If you have any pictures would be helpful, i own an English toy terrier

 

[BumbleFluff]

Do you have any photos of your girly?

I just googled both breeds, they look the same to me! :lol:

 

[Blitz]

I have no idea how to tell the difference.

 

[paddyjulie]

Does she have pencil marks on her toes/paws or thumb prints?

 

[Spendy]

Just took a few pics of her ... hope they came out okay.

 

[momentofmadness]

I think she is a terrier.. xxx

 

[paddyjulie]

I'm going to go with the english toy terrier because of the wedge shape face and the feet...Lil doglets would know best though with owning one herself

i most likely am wrong though :lol:

 

[Spendy]

I think she looks like a MinPin, but her markings seem to be rather un-MinPin like??

 

[Lil Doglets]

I would say min pin, everything about the body looks min pin to me - the shorter legs, squarer shaped body, the floppy ear (ETT should never have floppy ears) the tail is most definately not ETT it's thick and high set looking whereas ETT tail is very thin and sweeps down like a whippet tail when relaxed

A pic of my ETT as a comparison this one shows her body shape quite well and the thin tapered tail


As for the markings on the feet i found this in a minpin breed description-

Black and Tan: Black with sharply defined rust-red markings on cheeks, lips, lower jaw, throat, twin spots above eyes and chest, lower half of forelegs, inside of hind legs and vent region, lower portion of hocks and feet. Black pencil stripes on toes.

Because these dogs are small they are sometimes bred by people just out to make a dollar at the dog's and your expense, color can be a indicator of troubles to come with this breed. On puppy mill and back yard bred dogs, it is not uncommon to find white hair. It is also not uncommon to find thumb prints on the legs and no pencil marks on the toes. Also, Blue, Dilute Red and Dilute Chocolates Min Pins are showing up more and more often. Be very cautious of dogs of these colors. They cannot be shown in AKC dog shows in the confirmation ring. However, they are allowed in AKC obedience and agilty competitions. These colors are often advertised as "rare". Blues, silver, tans and dilutes are not recognized by the Miniature Pinscher Club of America. AKC color disqualifications:
Silver, tan, dilute and any color other than listed above. Blue is disqualified from the confirmation ring but can be registered.

Thumb print (patch of black hair surrounded by rust on the front of the foreleg between the foot and the wrist. On chocolates, the patch is chocolate hair).

White on any part of dog which exceeds one-half inch in its longest dimension.

Hope that's of some help

 

[Phoolf]

Looks minpin to me also.

 

[Spendy]

You wouldn't believe it ... this morning while walking Karma, a lovely lady came up and said what a lovely dog she was. Then she said "I've never seen a Manchester Terrier in this area, did you get him locally?" :yikes: (and yes, she said him)

Seeing that pic of Lil Doglets ETT, I'm convinced she isn't a ETT. She's much stockier.

As I mentioned before, it's just those markings on her legs. Not seen another MinPin with them. Ah well, she's my little angel and I couldn't love her more if I tried. Looking at the little face now and my heart is melting

 

[Spendy]

I would say min pin, everything about the body looks min pin to me - the shorter legs, squarer shaped body, the floppy ear (ETT should never have floppy ears) the tail is most definately not ETT it's thick and high set looking whereas ETT tail is very thin and sweeps down like a whippet tail when relaxed

A pic of my ETT as a comparison this one shows her body shape quite well and the thin tapered tail


As for the markings on the feet i found this in a minpin breed description-

Hope that's of some help

OMG, just read the rest of your post (got distracted by the super cute pic ). So, it looks like this lady was bl00dy dodgy. Well, if Karms did originally come from a puppy farm, I have been so lucky so far. Also, though I in no way support any sort of puppy farm environment, I couldn't imagine turning back time and not having her.

Did I mention how much I love her

 

[Lil Doglets]

You wouldn't believe it ... this morning while walking Karma, a lovely lady came up and said what a lovely dog she was. Then she said "I've never seen a Manchester Terrier in this area, did you get him locally?" :yikes: (and yes, she said him)

Seeing that pic of Lil Doglets ETT, I'm convinced she isn't a ETT. She's much stockier.

As I mentioned before, it's just those markings on her legs. Not seen another MinPin with them. Ah well, she's my little angel and I couldn't love her more if I tried. Looking at the little face now and my heart is melting

They are all very similar! I've often been asked if mine is either a manchester, a minpin or even a chihuahua lol
Even funnier was when i sent my Dad a picture of her on my lap and he said 'omg you haven't got a dobermann puppy have you?!' :lol:

 

[LauraJane9]

I am terrible with dogs breeds so can't say I just wanted to post to say how gorgeous she is!

 

[Spendy]

Okay, so after I concluded (with the help of you all) that Karms was definitely a MinPin, I got this email reply from the official ETT club.

Evening,

This is NOT a Min Pin.

I'd say she is a purebred ETT who looks to be in beautiful condition so you are doing a wonderful job. Such a pretty head and expression too.

I'd emailed the Official MinPin Club and ETT Club to ask their opinion before I posted on here. No response from the MinPin Club though.

 

[paddyjulie]

Okay, so after I concluded (with the help of you all) that Karms was definitely a MinPin, I got this email reply from the official ETT club.

Evening,

This is NOT a Min Pin.

I'd say she is a purebred ETT who looks to be in beautiful condition so you are doing a wonderful job. Such a pretty head and expression too.

I'd emailed the Official MinPin Club and ETT Club to ask their opinion before I posted on here. No response from the MinPin Club though.

bet your as confused as hell now :lol: whatever she is she is lovely !!

how old is she ?

 

[Spendy]

bet your as confused as hell now :lol: whatever she is she is lovely !!

how old is she ?

lmao ... darn right I am :lol:

And the thing is, the lady didn't even sound like there was a doubt in her mind!!

She's 7 months old

I think she's a Toy Miniature Terrier Pinscher.

 

[3dogs2cats]

Oh I hope the MinPin club get back to you, would be interesting to see what they think!

She is lovely whatever breed she may be.