Welcome to PetForums

Join thousands of other pet owners and pet lovers on the UK's most popular and friendly pet community and discussion forum.

Sign Up

In desperate need of help with westie puppy

Discussion in 'Dog Training and Behaviour' started by Rozellamooreuk, Jun 3, 2018.


Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. P
     
    #1 Rozellamooreuk, Jun 3, 2018
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 5, 2018
  2. labradrk

    labradrk PetForums VIP

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2012
    Messages:
    10,725
    Likes Received:
    12,914
    Hi, I found it quite hard to read your post as it's one giant block of text with no paragraphs or punctuation so I skimmed though. From what I did read:

    1) All of that behaviour is perfectly normal for a 13 week old puppy. Puppies are hard work and, if we are honest, not particularly rewarding.

    2) A puppy chewing stuff is a management issue. All puppies will wreck stuff if they are given the opportunity. If you take him outside, supervise him. Inside, you need to perhaps look at what you can do to make the rooms more 'puppy proof' - block off points of interest, and if you can't supervise directly, put him in a crate or x-pen.

    3) Crate him in your room overnight. This should stop the fussing/whining issue at night.

    4) Remove the toilet training pads - all they do is encourage the puppy to soil on the floor and delay the toilet training process. To toilet train a dog you need to be boringly consistent; you take him out EVERY time he wakes up, after he plays, after he drinks, eats etc. Basically any time he isn't asleep, you whisk him outside as a matter of routine.

    What are you actually DOING with him? bored puppies are more likely to be even more annoying than puppies generally are. Is he going out for two short walks daily? are you doing any sort of training with him so he gets to engage his brain? are you playing with him so he starts to develop a relationship with you?
     
  3. N
     
    #3 Rozellamooreuk, Jun 3, 2018
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 5, 2018
  4. Siskin

    Siskin Look into my eyes....

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2012
    Messages:
    14,236
    Likes Received:
    23,080
    And breathe.......


    You are really in a flap aren’t you. I take it this is the first puppy you have owned?

    At 13 weeks your pup does not know right from wrong and it up to you to teach him. He doesn’t understand what 'no’ means so it’s pointless saying no all the time unless he really knows what you mean.
    Get rid of the puppy pads as they only teach a puppy to that it’s ok to toilet indoors on something soft. Take your puppy out after waking, after a meal, after a playtime and about hourly intervals throughout the day. You will,probably have to get up at least once during the night to toilet, set the alarm. Take him out into the garden and wait until he goes, if he keeps messing about, take him out on the lead. When he is actually toileting say a cue word like ‘busy, busy’ or ‘goes wees’ or whatever suits you to say as you will be saying it a lot. Only say the words when he is actually toileting. When he has finished go to him and make a big fuss of him and give him an extra nice treat. Everytime he toilets say your cue words and eventually he will get the idea that those words mean he has to toilet.

    Get a crate and crate train your puppy so that he likes it, there’s plenty of information on this on the forum. Remember your puppy has only recently left the company of his mother and siblings and is now relying on you for comfort, he needs you now. He will only stop crying and following you when he is older and more confident.

    If you really decide you can’t keep him most breeders require you to return the puppy to them, it should have been explained to you when you signed the puppy contract. Contact the breeder for help anyway
     
    Lurcherlad likes this.
  5. Anonymous1004

    Anonymous1004 Dog Owner

    Joined:
    May 12, 2018
    Messages:
    18
    Likes Received:
    6
    That message was quite dense so I'm going to just say my advice on what I was able to read. Like the comment above this is normal behaviour for a puppy that old, but these suggestions may help you:

    ->You could maybe limit him to a certain area of the house (one where you are most likely to be and also has access to outside) just while he's a puppy. Check this area has nothing that can cause too too much harm and remove valuable things while he learns not to chew on things.

    -> Reward EVERYTHING he does right and ignore him if he does something wrong and deal with the problem, this means that he'll slowly learn what you like and dislike without compromising the relationship

    ->Gradually getting him used to the concept of being alone (start of with 10 minutes and slowly increase over a period of time.

    ->Enforce toilet training outside. Take him out every hour and after meals, before and after bed. When he does go outside make a massive fuss over him and give him treats.

    ->At the moment he's learning and it's still a new experience for him so just have patience and in the end it'll be rewarding.

    ->Also try and spend a few hours a day playing with him and start slowly teaching him sit and basic commands (he's only young so don't expect much) but it will help strengthen relationship.

    I hope this helps and your don't have to resort to re-homing.
     
  6. labradrk

    labradrk PetForums VIP

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2012
    Messages:
    10,725
    Likes Received:
    12,914
    I did not say you are doing nothing with him, I asked what you were doing with him. You repeatedly said he doesn't listen to you, but why would he? puppies have the attention span of a gnat, which is why you supervise and manage them to an inch of the their lives. The less you put them in the position of doing things you disapprove of, the fewer bad habits they develop.

    Getting a dog to listen to you comes with developing a relationship. When a dog WANTS to interact with you, everything else slots into place much easier. But that takes time and hard work and doesn't happen overnight.

    Are you intending to get any support with looking after the puppy then in that case - dog walkers, someone who can take you the puppy to dog training etc? it's very important for his development that he gets out and about into the 'real' world at least once a day for stimulation.
     
    Picklelily and Lurcherlad like this.
  7. Jamesgoeswalkies

    Jamesgoeswalkies PetForums VIP

    Joined:
    May 8, 2014
    Messages:
    4,980
    Likes Received:
    12,158
    Having read your post, I would suggest that you return him to the breeder - it's not too late - he is still very young. So yes, my advice would be to rehome.

    Puppies are very demanding and they make a mess and mine have all destroyed the garden in one way or another. And they need walking and training. You say your husband is already blaming you for getting a puppy and I suspect given that you tell us you both have health issues you are going to find the next year very hard. Because that is how long before your puppy starts to really grow up. And then he will need more walking, too.

    Perhaps an older, quieter rescue dog may suit you both better?

    J
     
  8. tabelmabel

    tabelmabel PetForums VIP

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2013
    Messages:
    6,172
    Likes Received:
    11,505
    Yes, returning to the breeder sounds like the most workable option in your case! I hope i don't sound rude (i don't mean to be) when i say it sounds like you did next to no preparation for having a puppy!

    All the problems you describe could have been completely avoided by proper crate training when you first brought pup home. Even for in the garden, it is so simple to create a little toilet area out of puppy pen panels and pop your pup in there.

    However, from what you have written, i think the learning curve would be too steep and this pup is too much for you.

    Maybe a rescue greyhound next time? They are really calm around the house and need little exercise.
     
  9. Sairy

    Sairy PetForums VIP

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2016
    Messages:
    6,161
    Likes Received:
    19,249
    I also think you may be better off returning the pup to the breeder. I have listed below your puppy's needs (beyond the obvious food, water, shelter etc.) and you can decide whether or not you are able to meet them.

    1. Whilst you are toilet training pup needs to be taken out every time he wakes, after eating or drinking, after playing and at least every hour otherwise. You need to wait with him until he toilets and then go over the top with praise and treats. Any mess in the house needs to be cleaned thoroughly and without fuss.

    2. He needs to be gradually introduced to being left alone, starting with in another room. Start with just a few seconds and go back before he gets anxious. You will need to practise this several times per day.

    3. Exercise - at this point two short walks per day (10-15 mins per walk is fine at the moment) would be best. As he gets older you can gradually increase the lengths of the walks, but he needs to be exercised every day. I would estimate that a young adult Westie would probably want at least 30 minutes - 1 hour free-running per day.

    4. He needs playtime with you - several short sessions each day and you can combine this with training to make it fun. Short sessions can be around 5 mins each and I'd aim for at least 2-3 sessions per day as his brain will be like a sponge at the moment.

    5. Socialisation. He needs to be introduced to the world in a controlled and positive way. This includes (but is not limited to) people, other dogs, traffic, different types of flooring, different sounds and smells etc. I would suggest choosing a different thing each day and take it at his pace.

    6. Training. He needs to be taught at least the basics such as how to walk on a lead, sit, wait, leave and come. You will also want to get him used to being examined and brushed.

    7. Grooming. I am not too familiar with the specific needs of a Westie so I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but I think they have to be clipped every so often as well as being brushed regularly.

    I would think very carefully whether you are able to commit to this throughout the dog's life. If you can't then it would be best all-round if he was returned to the breeder so that they can find someone who can. There is no shame in doing this by the way.

    I hope this helps.
     
  10. kimthecat

    kimthecat PetForums VIP

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2009
    Messages:
    16,363
    Likes Received:
    20,269
    Im sorry you are having a difficult time with your pup. They're very hard work.
    If you feel you cant cope then the best thing to do for him is to find another home for him. You could do this via a rescue such as the dogs trust , they would have not trouble finding him a home . If your dog came from a responsible breeder , then you cvan return him .
    You might be better off with a mature dog that needs less attention , many older dogs are desperate for homes.
     
  11. Lurcherlad

    Lurcherlad PetForums VIP

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2013
    Messages:
    24,735
    Likes Received:
    37,532
    I would return him to the breeder ASAP and actually NOT recommend getting an older rescue.

    They can need a lot of work to toilet train and settle into a new home, especially if they’ve had a troubled past and several homes already.

    Sounds like you have enough to deal with tbh
     
  12. kittih

    kittih PetForums VIP

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2014
    Messages:
    5,757
    Likes Received:
    8,569
    Just a few things to add. I can see that you and your husband thought it would be kinder to give your pup more space by using a stairgate rather than a pen or crate but unfortunately having some smaller spaces for a pup to be contained in actually helps the pup. It gives them a safe secure space where they can learn to settle. You can make those safe space really enjoyable places to be. Places he gets a treat like a filled kong, has a nice comfy bed and is associated with relaxing.

    When they are young they have no bladder control. The point at which they realise when they need to pee or poo is the exact moment they are absolutely desperate and can't wait. So as your pups new family you have to remind him to think about toileting regularly.

    I suggest you get him a house line. It is a light weight short lead with the handle cut off that he can wear all the time in the house. Every 30 minutes or as soon as he has eaten, woken up had a play pick up the house line and encourage him outside. Then holding onto the line take him to where you want him to toilet and become boring. Don't interact or speak with him just wait. Now it may well take a while at first and I mean a while but raising puppies is all about patience and consistency. When he goes say your cue word then once he's finished immediately give him a tasty treat and act like its the best ever thing you've ever seen and praise him.

    Take him inside on the line.

    If he is getting into things then make sure you can put as much as possible out of reach. You can also tie the house line to you so he cannot sneak off and get up to mischief. Have a selection of chew toys around the house then if he starts puppy biting you can put one of those in his mouth.

    Sometimes overtired puppies get like manic toddlers and become hyperactive so getting into a routine if plenty of nap times in a crate with a long or chew toy will help. Routine is your saviour. Try and set up a routine of naps toilet breaks eating playing and training. Ignore any pestering whining.

    Have a look at the links below for some help.

    It does sound like you have got a bad case of the puppy blues. Even seasoned owners get the overwhelmed " I can't cope" 'what have I done" thing.

    I think first you need to sit down with your husband and decide whether you want to keep him or not. If not contact the breeder and discuss returning him. Please don't advertise him on gumtree, pets for homes or the like. If returning to the breeder is not an option or give him to a reputable rescue.

    The puppy support thread has lots of good advice. It's quite long but you will see you are not alone.

    https://www.petforums.co.uk/threads/puppy-support-thread.448113/

    Look up crate training games by Susan Garrett she has a book and is also on YouTube.


    Also look up kikopup on YouTube. She has lots of useful videos. Below are some but I suggest if you decide to keep the pup you work your way through all of them.



    And here is her new puppy play list which are probably the best first videos to watch...

    https://m.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLsTGSaiFI2cdnRuJrSox2F1yZaPMpK8nt

    Good luck and if you decide to keep pup then we can help you through each of the issues.
    From your posts you sound completely overwhelmed and stressed. It will get better once you and your pup figure each other out, establish a routine and a relationship.

    Once you have decide what to do - keep pup or return him - if you decide to keep him come back and write a clear simple list of the behaviours you specifically want help with and we will provide some advice. Your first post is very hard to read (I think you just needed to get everything in your head written down which is understandable) but it isn't so easy for us to identify each of the things you need help with.
     
    #12 kittih, Jun 3, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2018
    Picklelily likes this.
  13. Picklelily

    Picklelily PetForums VIP

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2013
    Messages:
    3,330
    Likes Received:
    2,008
    Puppies are murder try looking at the puppy support thread and realise you aren't alone.

    Once you have had a read the thread have a clear think; are you just having a moment's panic and need some support or are you totally overwhelmed and feel you can't do this?

    Training a dog is pretty consistent effort over around 18 months for the first stage then top-ups through a lifetime. I assume you know this. I knew it having had dogs all my life but it didn't stop me feeling deathly at the puppy stage and again at the adolescent stage. The tough sessions do get less as they get older but at the moment you have the equivalent of a human baby at the crawling stage.

    If you decide you want to continue join a good puppy class- ask at the vets for details of local ones

    Know that as it grows your dog will need more exercise. My own small terrier needs a minimum of 1 hour 15 minutes walking a day, plus other stimuli in the form of training, this can help your health and anxiety if you can get the help you need.

    I can recommend the book the culture clash by Jean Donaldson it may help you understand where things are going wrong.

    Just to add no judgement from me you aren't the first to feel overwhelmed by a puppy and unprepared, it's where you go from here that will show your true metal do what is right for you and the puppy, whatever that maybe x
     
    kittih likes this.
  14. Rafa

    Rafa PetForums VIP

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2012
    Messages:
    14,613
    Likes Received:
    22,052

    I understand why you feel unable to walk him, but you have a high energy terrier breed who really will need regular walks throughout his life.

    I too feel you should return him to the Breeder.
     
    Lurcherlad likes this.
  15. Burrowzig

    Burrowzig PetForums VIP

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2009
    Messages:
    18,158
    Likes Received:
    11,920
    I also think he's be better off returned to the breeder - and you'd be better off without him. A cat would be a more suitable pet.
     
  16. Sorry this is a fake account set up in error by a friend I don’t own any pets I’ve asked admin to delete this post and close the account down as I don’t need it so please stop commenting thank you
     
  17. Siskin

    Siskin Look into my eyes....

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2012
    Messages:
    14,236
    Likes Received:
    23,080
    How odd
     
    JoanneF and Anonymous1004 like this.
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice