Welcome to PetForums

Join thousands of other pet owners and pet lovers on the UK's most popular and friendly pet community and discussion forum.

Sign Up

Dog training is so complicated these days

Discussion in 'Dog Training and Behaviour' started by SEVEN_PETS, Apr 24, 2011.


  1. SEVEN_PETS

    SEVEN_PETS PetForums VIP

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2009
    Messages:
    6,662
    Likes Received:
    133
    (posted on another thread but thought would start up my own thread as well)

    I think dog training is very complicated these days. When my parents had dogs, it was common to use a choke chain to prevent pulling, and guess what it did. They didn't have tv programs or the internet to get advice about training dogs, dogs were expected to behave or they were punished. I personally wouldn't use harsh methods these days but it worked.

    These days, I think its very difficult to have a fully trained dog. The vast majority of ill behaved dogs proves that. With all the information out there, you would think the world would be full of incredibly trained dogs, but the fact is, there isn't.

    There are so many theories, with each theory disapproving the other theories, and dog owners don't know where to turn. Some people would say you would need to use choke chains/prong collars/electric collars to make a dog behave, others say these are downright cruel and you should use treats alone.

    Dog behaviour is hugely complicated and no one person understands it completely. Training a dog to do tricks, like sit, stay is easy with treats, however living with a dog day-to-day is hard work and even the most obedient dogs are difficult dogs to live with. Even with toilet training, there is different advice, some say use training pads, others say this is wrong and you should make them go outside straight away. Who is right? Who do you believe?

    Even with Ollie's barking problem, I had some people telling me to completely ignore him, others telling me to tell him off, and others telling me to bring him indoors silently. Each piece of advice contridicts the others so its no wonder most dog owners are confused and find dog training difficult. I think there should be one style of dog training and one solution to every problem, then it wouldn't be so difficult.
     
  2. lucyandsandy

    lucyandsandy PetForums VIP

    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2011
    Messages:
    2,099
    Likes Received:
    34
    I think there are lots of very well trained dogs out there but not very many trained owners tbh. I have had different advice on how to raise my puppy and I have used most of it on a trail and error basis to find out what works for me and my puppy.

    At the end of the day it is your choice what training methods to do and only the owner knows their dog best and what will work for them.
     
  3. newfiesmum

    newfiesmum Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2010
    Messages:
    19,251
    Likes Received:
    1,726
    I don't think dogs are any less trained nowadays than they were in the past, just that you see more of them out with their owners whereas when I was little it was common to just let the dog out to entertain himself. I remember lots of dogs wandering about on their own, I don't remember seeing many dogwalkers. People did not walk their dogs so much back in the fifties, that is a fact, at least in London.

    I don't come across very many really badly trained dogs but I think that is because a lot of people are embarrassed and don't take them where they are going to meet others.

    As to puppy pads, all Ferdie did with them was to rip them up and eat them. I think it is best to take the dog outside from the beginning, far less confusing. Puppy pads make great liners for rabbit hutches, though. That is what happened to the rest of the packet!
     
  4. McKenzie

    McKenzie PetForums VIP

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2010
    Messages:
    20,470
    Likes Received:
    20,329
    I don't think it's just confined to dogs - the same thing relates to raising kids, to teaching, and probably all sorts of other things.

    I agree that it's complicated and difficult and really a life-long process. But in my mind the abundance of different ideas out there is really a good thing. We know that the same methods don't work for all dogs (or kids) so having more than one method of doing things makes it more likely that you'll be able to find something that suits you and your dog :)
     
  5. northnsouth

    northnsouth PetForums VIP

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2009
    Messages:
    6,286
    Likes Received:
    277
    We all get bombarded by experts who know about everything. It happens with everything. What ever happened to using your own good judgement and common sense ?
     
  6. McKenzie

    McKenzie PetForums VIP

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2010
    Messages:
    20,470
    Likes Received:
    20,329
    The problem with good judgement and common sense is that not everyone is in possession of them... :rolleyes:
     
  7. northnsouth

    northnsouth PetForums VIP

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2009
    Messages:
    6,286
    Likes Received:
    277
    True....I forget the obvious some times, I should not judge by my own standards:D
     
  8. Old Shep

    Old Shep PetForums VIP

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2010
    Messages:
    3,290
    Likes Received:
    100
    In the "olden days" people opened their doors in the morning and let the dog run free till tea time. People didn't routinely spay their dogs and there were lots and lots of pups born to be either tied in a sack and drowned, or given away to the local cat and dogs home (where they would be, in all probability, be euthenised.) Badly behaved dogs were not tolerated. Their fate also lay in the local dog and cats home from where thay would never return. No one took a sick dog to the vet. Granny would give it some home remedy and it would die.*

    Stop looking at the past through rose tinted spectacles.

    *I'm using absolutes here for effect. I'm sure you get the picture.
     
  9. northnsouth

    northnsouth PetForums VIP

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2009
    Messages:
    6,286
    Likes Received:
    277
    Our dogs were never allowed to run free, they regularly went to the vet, bitches in heat were kept confined to prevent unwanted puppies.. I don't believe in the good old days but I don't think modern is always best either. Living in a cotton wool cloud or 21st century mooly coddling is rather silly too!
     
  10. newfiesmum

    newfiesmum Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2010
    Messages:
    19,251
    Likes Received:
    1,726
    You are right. That is where most of our puppies came from, accidental puppies were usually taken down the market and sold off really cheap. If there was one left at the end of the day, it ended up in the river, unless dad got there first and brought it home. Hooray! We always had dogs, usually two at a time, but I only ever remember a vet once, when our dobermann/mastiff cross caught a virus. Our dogs were never just let out to wander, but they were not walked either. Nobody thought it vital and someone would take them if they felt like it. And I never knew there was such a thing as dog food. The dog had whatever we were having, and my mother kept that philosophy until the day she died in 1987. As far as she was concerned, if came out of a can it could not be any good.

    I am talking about the fifties here. What era are you talking about?
     
  11. Old Shep

    Old Shep PetForums VIP

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2010
    Messages:
    3,290
    Likes Received:
    100
    Newfiesmum: You and I must be of the same generation!
     
  12. newfiesmum

    newfiesmum Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2010
    Messages:
    19,251
    Likes Received:
    1,726
    Sounds that way. I think things were easier in the fifties, no one worried about their kids being out till late, never mind the dogs. Everything was so innocent and of course, we were the first teenagers! Well, my brother was, I just missed that. And we had all that wonderful real rock n' roll music! Nothing was so materialistic, everyone had morals (well most people) but then I can't say it is a bad thing to be a bit more enlightened.

    I sometimes look back nostalgically to the fifties and then think: I couldn't do without the internet, or my mobile phone, or my Sky plus, or my car comforts! I suppose you can't have it both ways.

    Vets were few and far between in those days because not many people had any use for them.
     
  13. Old Shep

    Old Shep PetForums VIP

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2010
    Messages:
    3,290
    Likes Received:
    100
    The only vet available in our town was the monthly visit of the PDSA van. Distemper was also fairly common.

    My father brought home a dog from the cat and dog home. It was a yellow lab and within a couple of days it started to growl and snap at my brothers and I. One morning it wasn't there anymore and my dad said he had given it to one of his friends who was a gamekeeper in the broders. I only found out a few years ago that he took it back to the dogs' home (where it would have been pts). No one even considered that you could perhaps overcome these problems. Dogs were more of a comodity then (I know they still are to some, unscrupulous people. But it was more common then). I don't remember dogs living into their teens either. They seemed to last till about 8.
     
  14. kat&molly

    kat&molly PetForums VIP

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2011
    Messages:
    5,595
    Likes Received:
    47
    I think a lot of todays theories are confusing-I dont even understand a lot of the stuff thats posted in this section of the forum, so I dont have much chance of trying to follow it:eek:
    Having said that, I do like the fact that things have moved on and most of us train by nice methods. I've enjoyed every bit of training I've done with Molly , because I know shes enjoyed it too- shes learnt because she wanted to and not because she was too frightened not to..
    Seven Pets , we've both had a problem with our dogs barking in the garden- you was advised to try a long line, and I think you've said its working but that wouldn't work for me, in this house, so going out and telling Scruff 'IN' is what I'm doing.
    Sometimes the 'multiple' choices help.:)
     
  15. newfiesmum

    newfiesmum Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2010
    Messages:
    19,251
    Likes Received:
    1,726
    Well we did have a collie x retriever, call Peter of all things, who lived to be 17. I remember the PDSA van!
     
  16. Twiggy

    Twiggy PetForums VIP

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2010
    Messages:
    13,742
    Likes Received:
    6,236
    Having said that, I do like the fact that things have moved on and most of us train by nice methods. I've enjoyed every bit of training I've done with Molly , because I know shes enjoyed it too- shes learnt because she wanted to and not because she was too frightened not to..

    Exactly and I couldn't agree more.
     
  17. Old Shep

    Old Shep PetForums VIP

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2010
    Messages:
    3,290
    Likes Received:
    100
    I think dog training today is as "complicated" as you want it to be. If you are interested you can explore it further and find out more, and if not, just stick with the basics. Noone is forcing dog owners to understand things they don't want to. In fact I would be wary of a dog trainer if they came out with a lot of "jargon" in an ordinary training class. I think that's just an ego trip for the trainer (and also shows a wee bit of lack of confidence, if they have to rely on bamboozleing others).

    Dog training's like any other hobby. You learn as much as you are interested in knowing. For some people that will be LOTS and for others, not so much!
     
  18. newfiesmum

    newfiesmum Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2010
    Messages:
    19,251
    Likes Received:
    1,726
    I suppose it depends on what you want from your dog really. Today's methods are basically what I have been doing for years, just more or less treat the dog like I treated the children. I was never much good at recalling them, though, to be honest, so I have learned a lot about that.

    I hate to see a dog who is too obedient, and it is obvious he is doing as he is told because he scared to do anything else.
     
  19. leashedForLife

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2009
    Messages:
    19,309
    Likes Received:
    3,664
    - reward what U want more of; the reward can be anything the dog will work for, or really likes
    [not YOUR opinion, here - the dog's]

    - eliminate rewards for behavior U don't want anymore.

    - prevent self-rewarding behaviors:
    escaping out the door, etc. if the dog is prone to that, INSTALL A SET-BACK: a permanent baby-gate if U have careless kids
    [or a careless spouse]; a tether close to the door to sign for packages with the dog secured; other options.
     
  20. grandad

    grandad PetForums VIP

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2011
    Messages:
    1,589
    Likes Received:
    25
    I don't think dog training is to complicated. I think that some of the professionals like to use language that makes it seem complicated. Which is why, my friends and I go to and seek out trainers that use everyday language and explain things in simple terms.
    I think people also, like to know more about dog phychology and try to understand dog behaviour more and this in turn helps them in their training regime.
    It certainly does for me and my doggy friends.
     
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice