[LauraJane9]

Hi Guys, Sully is the first dog I have ever bought and before joining this forum I had no idea about health checks, I knew to watch out for puppy farms but sadly I think I was very ignorant, the woman I got Sully from owned two Shih Tzu's who had a litter, I saw the parents and they appeared healthy and were very friendly and well behaved, the puppies were in the living room in a play pen type thing, the woman was also keeping one of the puppies for herself and gave us a seven day health guarantee, was this a backyard breeder?

 

[Gertrude]

Maybe not?

was this the first litter or did she say she'd had/was going to have a few more?

The situation sounds similar to when I got Meg, I phoned beforehand and asked tons of questions which she answered quickly and well, but on arrival, the pups [tho looked well] were dirty and smelled of pee [as did the house!]

I'd only had dogs from rescues before this, so although I knew what to ask I wasn't sure what I'd 'find' when I got there - all is well tho

Not all people who have a litter at home are byb, just the ones who use their girls as money making machines

 

[Netpon]

Did you get a puppy pack? (copies of health tests, KC certificate, 5 generation pedigree, 4 weeks insurance, some food and an information pack about the breed)? If not then yes it does sound like someone who I would class as a BYB. Most 'genuine' breeders don't own both parents, they would usually use a stud dog owned by someone else as they want to use the best dog for their bitch and the chances of that being one of their own dogs is quite slim (unless they bought it in specifically)

This is the problem, most people don't know what to look for.

 

[Luz]

Depends on people's opinion of BYB I would think. Did she come with papers and KC reg?

 

[rona]

Difficult to say, though having both parents isn't usual for a good well thought out mating, it isn't impossible either.
Shih Tzu do not have any relevant health checks according to the KC

The Kennel Club

 

[RAINYBOW]

I think there is another category of breeder. The Hobby or "Home" Breeder.

Ok so they don't do all the health tests etc but i think generally they take great care over raising the puppies, arent really in it "just for the cash" and if you was happy with the conditions then thats all that counts really.

It's a far cry from puppy farms churning out sickly pups from poor "breeding machines" .

There are some breeds i really wouldnt buy without health tests but my Cocker came from what i considered to be a good "hobby breeder" and yes i could have bought better probably but then tbh i could have bought a lot worse.

Don't beat yourself up about it, live and learn and enjoy your dog

 

[newfiesmum]

Hi Guys, Sully is the first dog I have ever bought and before joining this forum I had no idea about health checks, I knew to watch out for puppy farms but sadly I think I was very ignorant, the woman I got Sully from owned two Shih Tzu's who had a litter, I saw the parents and they appeared healthy and were very friendly and well behaved, the puppies were in the living room in a play pen type thing, the woman was also keeping one of the puppies for herself and gave us a seven day health guarantee, was this a backyard breeder?

I think that depends on your point of view. My grandaughter's cocker spaniel came from just such a set up, both parents owned, 11 pups, all very healthy and friendly. He is three now and is a little love; had no problems healthwise. My retriever was probably from a similar set up, but no father in sight. All the other pups had gone when I got him as he was a little older. He lived to be fourteen and never much wrong with him.

Don't assume that this sort of set up is going to produce unhealthy pups, because that is far from true. Just enjoy your dog and stop worrying!

 

[Fleur]

It's such a subjective thing - so difficult to comment without knowing more about your breeders, breeding practices.

 

[newfiesmum]

I think there is another category of breeder. The Hobby or "Home" Breeder.

Ok so they don't do all the health tests etc but i think generally they take great care over raising the puppies, arent really in it "just for the cash" and if you was happy with the conditions then thats all that counts really.

It's a far cry from puppy farms churning out sickly pups from poor "breeding machines" .

There are some breeds i really wouldnt buy without health tests but my Cocker came from what i considered to be a good "hobby breeder" and yes i could have bought better probably but then tbh i could have bought a lot worse.

Don't beat yourself up about it, live and learn and enjoy your dog

Just thinking, some breeds I would not buy like this either. I certainly wouldn't buy a giant breed from this sort of set up, or one that is known for its guarding traits like a rottie or a gsd.

 

[Gertrude]

Some people can own two same breed dogs and have an 'accidental' litter, or hobby breed as said above.

*I* dont class those as BYB

[if its genuine, and they get the parents neutered after]

 

[Netpon]

Just thinking, some breeds I would not buy like this either. I certainly wouldn't buy a giant breed from this sort of set up, or one that is known for its guarding traits like a rottie or a gsd.

Just curious, why? If both parents are seen and of sound temperament?

Believe me, after 20 years in a vets and 3 as a groomer, I've seen a lot of Shihs that are worse than any rott or shepherd I've ever met!!

IMHO, it doesn't matter what breed you buy, you should research the breeder and ask them as many questions as they (should) ask you!

 

[LauraJane9]

The litter was apparently the first and last litter and I think it was mainly because she wanted to keep one of the pups, there were no papers or health checks (before I joined this forum I believed papers were just for show dogs), and if I'm honest I in no way regret buying Sully from her, if I knew what I do now things would of been different but Sully is an amazing dog, from day one he has been confident and friendly, he is amazing with other dogs and people, when he comes across a small child, puppy or small dog he lies down instead of his usual jumping and licking, he learns commands and tricks within minutes not hours and he isn't scared of anything, thunder, fireworks, motor bikes roaring right past him, even the vet has said what a well behaved and brave dog he is, I have to admit that it's a mistake I'm really glad I made.

 

[Netpon]

The litter was apparently the first and last litter and I think it was mainly because she wanted to keep one of the pups, there were no papers or health checks (before I joined this forum I believed papers were just for show dogs), and if I'm honest I in no way regret buying Sully from her, if I knew what I do now things would of been different but Sully is an amazing dog, from day one he has been confident and friendly, he is amazing with other dogs and people, when he comes across a small child, puppy or small dog he lies down instead of his usual jumping and licking, he learns commands and tricks within minutes not hours and he isn't scared of anything, thunder, fireworks, motor bikes roaring right past him, even the vet has said what a well behaved and brave dog he is, I have to admit that it's a mistake I'm really glad I made.

And thats all that matters now, just enjoy your bundle of fun! (and can we have some pics pretty please!)

 

[LauraJane9]

I will post pics tomorrow if I can figure out how!

 

[Gertrude]

The litter was apparently the first and last litter and I think it was mainly because she wanted to keep one of the pups, there were no papers or health checks (before I joined this forum I believed papers were just for show dogs), and if I'm honest I in no way regret buying Sully from her, if I knew what I do now things would of been different but Sully is an amazing dog, from day one he has been confident and friendly, he is amazing with other dogs and people, when he comes across a small child, puppy or small dog he lies down instead of his usual jumping and licking, he learns commands and tricks within minutes not hours and he isn't scared of anything, thunder, fireworks, motor bikes roaring right past him, even the vet has said what a well behaved and brave dog he is, I have to admit that it's a mistake I'm really glad I made.

You know what?
I very nearly walked away from Meg and all the other 7 pups because the home wasn't too good and it did smell badly of wee
But their whole family were in the kitchen with us including 2 little children and all the pups were so calm and friendly that I just thought 'Oh well I do luv this lil girl and I can bath her' [as everything apart from the bad smell seemed ok]

I'm SO glad I took her she is such a clever special doggie and I love the very bones of her

Just enjoy Sully like I do Meg

Also, for a while we added a 'S' for smelly to the beginning of Megs name ... she was Smeg for some time.... and still is on occasions!! :lol:

 

[newfiesmum]

Just curious, why? If both parents are seen and of sound temperament?

Believe me, after 20 years in a vets and 3 as a groomer, I've seen a lot of Shihs that are worse than any rott or shepherd I've ever met!!

IMHO, it doesn't matter what breed you buy, you should research the breeder and ask them as many questions as they (should) ask you!

Well a giant I would definitely want all the right health checks, especially the hip scoring, elbow scoring and heart scans. They are so prone to joint problems and heart problems (well newfies are). As to the guarding breeds, I would be wondering if they were bred for that trait. Many, many years ago we bought a gsd puppy who turned out to be a pure guarding breed, as we didn't know anything about them. That would put me off.