[saffrondeen]

Just wanted some feedback on what I feed my cats please am happy for some new suggestions and ideas.

Rumpus is a neutered male of about 2-3 yrs he is being fed Royal Canin young male neutered dry food.
The vet recommended this.
He wont eat wet food or any meat or fish. I have tried him with poached chicken, turkey fish etc. He likes potato and yoghurt but i dont give it to him often. He has webbox cat sticks for a treat.

His poos are very smelly!!!

My new kitten, Boo, eats whiskas kitten wet and cat milk until shes a bit older, but then not sure what to give her. Im not really keen on wet food as it goes all dry and yukky when not eaten right away.
whats the best?

 

[hobbs2004]

Hey and welcome to the forum.

I presume since posting this thread you have had a read around this forum and have realised that most of us on here feed, and advise others to feed too, wet or raw food. The reasons for this are plastered on numerous threads on here, so please do have a read.

Re the kitten, I personally would ditch the cat milk - not really necessary or as nutritious as real cat food would be.

Re what to feed them both in terms of brands. Again, I would read around the forum and you will soon realise that most of the brands that are fed by people here are had from zooplus - an online shop.

Do have a read around and all the best.

 

[Alessa]

Hey and welcome to the forum.

I presume since posting this thread you have had a read around this forum and have realised that most of us on here feed, and advise others to feed too, wet or raw food. The reasons for this are plastered on numerous threads on here, so please do have a read.

Re the kitten, I personally would ditch the cat milk - not really necessary or as nutritious as real cat food would be.

Re what to feed them both in terms of brands. Again, I would read around the forum and you will soon realise that most of the brands that are fed by people here are had from zooplus - an online shop.

Do have a read around and all the best.

Hi hobbs! I want to take this opportunity to ask you, since I could not find the answer in the forums.

Is it alright to feed my 15 week old ragdoll kitten a diet of roughly 30% wet (Bozita, Lily's Kitchen or Animonda Carny), 35% Ziwi Peak air-dehydrated dry and 35% Orijen kibble? Would that be too overwhelming? I know people feed their cats/kittens a diet of Orijen + Bozita, but I have never heard of anyone feeding Ziwi Peak dry mixed with either a kibble or wet food!

 

[hobbs2004]

Hi hobbs! I want to take this opportunity to ask you, since I could not find the answer in the forums.

Is it alright to feed my 15 week old ragdoll kitten a diet of roughly 30% wet (Bozita, Lily's Kitchen or Animonda Carny), 35% Ziwi Peak air-dehydrated dry and 35% Orijen kibble? Would that be too overwhelming? I know people feed their cats/kittens a diet of Orijen + Bozita, but I have never heard of anyone feeding Ziwi Peak dry mixed with either a kibble or wet food!

Theoretically it is all possible. I don't see why that would be overwhelming. However, I am not a big fan of dry food at all and although Ziwi Peak has got a little more moisture than traditional dry food, it is still a dry food in my book. So, your kittens diet would consist mainly of dry food, which, well....

Is there a reason why would want to feed the rather hideously expensive Ziwi Peak dry as well as the orijen and not just one of those and feed more wet?

Have you tried your kitten on the Ziwi Peak? Weird texture that I don't think is terribly palatable to cats.

Hope that helps?

 

[Alessa]

Theoretically it is all possible. I don't see why that would be overwhelming. However, I am not a big fan of dry food at all and although Ziwi Peak has got a little more moisture than traditional dry food, it is still a dry food in my book. So, your kittens diet would consist mainly of dry food, which, well....

Is there a reason why would want to feed the rather hideously expensive Ziwi Peak dry as well as the orijen and not just one of those and feed more wet?

Have you tried your kitten on the Ziwi Peak? Weird texture that I don't think is terribly palatable to cats.

Hope that helps?

Yes that definitely helps! Many many thanks!

I wanted to feed him Ziwi Peak because if I were to believe Liz from naturecatcare blog, it is one of the best food overall, as it is closest to raw. I do not really want to venture into the raw department because I do not think I would be capable of handling it. I agree that it is hideously expensive, and I wonder if simply going on a 50% Orijen and 50% Bozita would be enough? Of course there is an option of 50% Ziwipeak and 50% Bozita.

I am not sure whether or not he will like it (I actually am about to pick him up from the breeders next week!), but all I know is he is just on Royal Canin dry and I can't wait to start gradually changing his diet to something healthier! I do not think I would want to let go of dry completely, which is the reason why I am opting for the best quality dry foods. I also intend to get him a water fountain to make sure he gets plenty of of water to offset the fact that he is on 50% dry diet.

I also am concerned about stool size and smell, as I live in a 1-bedroom apartment, but I haven't found an extensive discussion on stool size vs food just yet!

 

[chillminx]

Alessa, if you want to avoid your cat producing smelly stools, the best diet is raw, as it is low residue, so most of what the cat eats gets used and digested.

But if you are not keen to go down the raw route, then choose a wet food that is high in meat content, and contains no grains. It is the carbs (grains) in the food which are mainly responsible for large amount of smelly poo, as the cat's digestive system is not equipped to digest carbs (other than the tiny amount that might be found in the stomach or crop of its prey).

As you mention Ziwipeak -- their canned food is grain-free and is high in meat content, so why not start with that, as one of the foods? Then find a couple of other wet foods of similar quality, so you have about 3 to rotate.

EDIT: there have been quite a few discussions on here in the recent past about diet and smelly stools! Perhaps try a *Search* and see what you can find

 

[hobbs2004]

Yes that definitely helps! Many many thanks!

I wanted to feed him Ziwi Peak because if I were to believe Liz from naturecatcare blog, it is one of the best food overall, as it is closest to raw. I do not really want to venture into the raw department because I do not think I would be capable of handling it. I agree that it is hideously expensive, and I wonder if simply going on a 50% Orijen and 50% Bozita would be enough? Of course there is an option of 50% Ziwipeak and 50% Bozita.

I am not sure whether or not he will like it (I actually am about to pick him up from the breeders next week!), but all I know is he is just on Royal Canin dry and I can't wait to start gradually changing his diet to something healthier! I do not think I would want to let go of dry completely, which is the reason why I am opting for the best quality dry foods. I also intend to get him a water fountain to make sure he gets plenty of of water to offset the fact that he is on 50% dry diet.

I also am concerned about stool size and smell, as I live in a 1-bedroom apartment, but I haven't found an extensive discussion on stool size vs food just yet!

Well, I personally would disagree with the assessment of Ziwi Peak as being one of the best foods because it is the closest to raw. Its major drawback imo is still the lack of moisture.

When I was given a trial pack of that stuff I couldn't get my cats to eat it (they don't eat dry at all) so cannot say what the output on that food might be. Generally, however, the better quality the food, the more gets utilised and the less gets dispelled in a smelly manner (generally speaking - sensitivities to certain food stuff excluded, of course). So, for the least smelly and smallest output, the vote goes to raw for a mile.

Although by no means ideal, there are some commercially available raw cat minces out there that might be a good temporary solution while you get your head around raw (I would never advise to just go down the commercially preprepared raw food route without at the same time making oneself knowledgeable about raw). You could feed raw minces and good quality wet food instead. Just a thought.

There is an increasingly great range of good quality wet out there (most of it is still only available from German online shops currently though zooplus at one point had plans to stock two more good brands) that imo are infinitely favourable to the Ziwi Peak dry.

However, I personally don't feed Bozita.

Anyhow, I personally would re-consider the decision to feed 50% dry. Any particular reason why you would want to do that?

 

[Alessa]

Alessa, if you want to avoid your cat producing smelly stools, the best diet is raw, as it is low residue, so most of what the cat eats gets used and digested.

But if you are not keen to go down the raw route, then choose a wet food that is high in meat content, and contains no grains. It is the carbs (grains) in the food which are mainly responsible for large amount of smelly poo, as the cat's digestive system is not equipped to digest carbs (other than the tiny amount that might be found in the stomach or crop of its prey).

As you mention Ziwipeak -- their canned food is grain-free and is high in meat content, so why not start with that, as one of the foods? Then find a couple of other wet foods of similar quality, so you have about 3 to rotate.

EDIT: there have been quite a few discussions on here in the recent past about diet and smelly stools! Perhaps try a *Search* and see what you can find

Thanks a lot! Perhaps I have just been typing in the wrong keywords or not searching properly. I have been reading other people's opinions and it seems to vary on both ends of the scale, but I think it is starting to make more sense now!

 

[Guest]

Hi there. I was just wondering what factor about raw feeding is it you feel you would not be able to handle? Is it the look of the meat or getting the balance right, or just the fact it's raw?

I'm just asking as a lot of raw food companies make minced which are the perfect balance of flesh/bone/offal, and come in freezer bags which you just defrost and pour into a bowl. It doesn't differ that much from what cat food looks like, yet it's the ultimate diet for them. You can continue to give the sticks etc to help with teeth cleaning.

It's also a lot cheaper!

 

[Alessa]

Well, I personally would disagree with the assessment of Ziwi Peak as being one of the best foods because it is the closest to raw. Its major drawback imo is still the lack of moisture.

When I was given a trial pack of that stuff I couldn't get my cats to eat it (they don't eat dry at all) so cannot say what the output on that food might be. Generally, however, the better quality the food, the more gets utilised and the less gets dispelled in a smelly manner (generally speaking - sensitivities to certain food stuff excluded, of course). So, for the least smelly and smallest output, the vote goes to raw for a mile.

Although by no means ideal, there are some commercially available raw cat minces out there that might be a good temporary solution while you get your head around raw (I would never advise to just go down the commercially preprepared raw food route without at the same time making oneself knowledgeable about raw). You could feed raw minces and good quality wet food instead. Just a thought.

There is an increasingly great range of good quality wet out there (most of it is still only available from German online shops currently though zooplus at one point had plans to stock two more good brands) that imo are infinitely favourable to the Ziwi Peak dry.

However, I personally don't feed Bozita.

Anyhow, I personally would re-consider the decision to feed 50% dry. Any particular reason why you would want to do that?

Hi again!

Thanks for the very thorough answers to my questions! It's shedding some more light now! Are you feeding your own cats a raw diet then? The thought of going that route intimidates me mainly because I can never be sure of the quality of the meat I can get where I am at!

As for my decision to feed a mixture of dry and wet, the reason is that he has been eating only dry Royal Canin kibble so far, so I thought it would be better to put him on a slow transition of Royal Canin --> Orijen -- > Ziwipeak with mix of wet food on all instances. I understand that I only really need to ensure he drinks enough water to compensate for the fact he will be partly eating dry food.

I do plan to to eventually feed a good quality wet food, but again I am finding it hard to find a decent brand. I live near Wholefoods where they have Lily's Kitchen, but it seems expensive for what it is (I might be wrong)?

I extremely interested where you can find commercial raw cat mince?

 

[Alessa]

Hi there. I was just wondering what factor about raw feeding is it you feel you would not be able to handle? Is it the look of the meat or getting the balance right, or just the fact it's raw?

I'm just asking as a lot of raw food companies make minced which are the perfect balance of flesh/bone/offal, and come in freezer bags which you just defrost and pour into a bowl. It doesn't differ that much from what cat food looks like, yet it's the ultimate diet for them. You can continue to give the sticks etc to help with teeth cleaning.

It's also a lot cheaper!

I am worried about getting the balance right and sourcing from the right people. I have nothing against raw meat, as I love it personally. I like my steak blue and eat a lot of raw meat myself: fish, beef, pork(Zwiebelmet), you name it, and frankly do not care about what happens to me (lol), but I care about what could happen to my cat, as he will be my responsibility.

I live in central London and I guess it adds to the paranoia that I am in the middle of a dirty city and not in a nice countryside where everything is fresh. Ideally, it would be great to be able to have a place where I can physically purchase too.

I am looking at Nature's menu and Prize Choice as of the moment, I will be moving into a new flat with a large freezer soon, so it might not be too bad after all!

 

[hobbs2004]

I am looking at Nature's menu and Prize Choice as of the moment, I will be moving into a new flat with a large freezer soon, so it might not be too bad after all!

Firstly, that is the very reason why I said that it would still make sense for any person who wants to feed commercially prepared raw food to make themselves knowledgeable about a raw food diet because all raw pet food isn't made equal and not all raw pet food is properly balanced (in terms of the raw feeding ratios of meat to bone to liver to other offal).

Nature's menu and prize choice are two cases in point. They are made for dogs (who can arguably deal with more veg in their diet- say) and aren't balanced enough to be of any use for cats.

In the UK there are only two suppliers worth their salt in terms of raw food for cats and they are Natural Instinct and Honeys.

I don't quite follow your reasoning as to why you cannot get good quality raw meat because you live in London? That is perhaps one of the funniest statements I have heard in a while. The quality of butchers (in terms of what they offer; not the actual quality of what they sell as that is quite tightly controlled) varies regardless of location and there are plenty of butchers and you even have smithfield market if you are prepared to wake up early!

 

[Alessa]

Firstly, that is the very reason why I said that it would still make sense for any person who wants to feed commercially prepared raw food to make themselves knowledgeable about a raw food diet because all raw pet food isn't made equal and not all raw pet food is properly balanced (in terms of the raw feeding ratios of meat to bone to liver to other offal).

Nature's menu and prize choice are two cases in point. They are made for dogs (who can arguably deal with more veg in their diet- say) and aren't balanced enough to be of any use for cats.

In the UK there are only two suppliers worth their salt in terms of raw food for cats and they are Natural Instinct and Honeys.

I don't quite follow your reasoning as to why you cannot get good quality raw meat because you live in London? That is perhaps one of the funniest statements I have heard in a while. The quality of butchers (in terms of what they offer; not the actual quality of what they sell as that is quite tightly controlled) varies regardless of location and there are plenty of butchers and you even have smithfield market if you are prepared to wake up early!

Oops I think I just unintentionally got laughed at. Forgive me for saying this, but I did not think that comment was really necessary. I came here to seek for help and meet like-minded people, I already feel bad now that I am turning myself into some kind of fool :crying:, please take it easy on me. I am sorry, I am just a new cat owner looking for the best possible food that I could or even couldn't afford for my new kitten. I am no nutritionist, and I am just trying my best.

Anyway, thanks for letting me know which companies to look out for, because there seems to be way too many, and their actual ingredients isn't always readily available in their descriptions, and to be quite honest there is even a disagreement as to what other vitamins should be added in. I thought Prize Choice did not have the vegetables and grains, on their minces. I was thinking of simply adding what vitamins and nutrients is lacking, but if they do have other things there apart from the mince meat and offal and some vitamin mixes, then I guess that crosses it out of my list. I am going to look more into Natural Instinct and Honeys. Is it safe to give him raw food after a week of settling in, and after 15 weeks of being fed on only Royal Canin dry? Of course I'll have to feed it both first and slowly transition into raw food + wet food only.

I think the best solution would be to find out if anyone on these forums who lives in London and feeds raw, and if so, where they are sourcing their meat from? I am personally finding it hard to find a trusted butcher here (in terms of raw meat), there a lot yes, but I am inexperienced when it comes to checking their quality, as they all seem to be saying the same thing. Most of them are small butchers, and it makes me wonder how whole livestock gets delivered to them, and whether or not traveling of already-butchered meat is involved. Anyway, I will certainly check smithfield out if I can find the time (writing a PhD thesis, applying for jobs and moving is keeping me away from everything else), but then again I am expecting not all traders there would be reliable and I still need to know how to assess properly, and I have no idea where to start on that one.

 

[hobbs2004]

Oops I think I just unintentionally got laughed at. Forgive me for saying this, but I did not think that comment was really necessary. I came here to seek for help and meet like-minded people, I already feel bad now that I am turning myself into some kind of fool :crying:, please take it easy on me. I am sorry, I am just a new cat owner looking for the best possible food that I could or even couldn't afford for my new kitten. I am no nutritionist, and I am just trying my best.

Hey, don't be offended by my "funny statement" comment. The human meat industry (and the butchers that are associated with it) are so tightly controlled and regulated in the UK that I think you might want to address your worries and misconceptions head-on. I very highly doubt that there are any disreputable sellers in Smithfield market, considering it is the market where loads of well-known restaurants etc get their meat from. But you have to be up early as this is a wholeseller.

The key to raw feeding is that you build up a good relationship with your local butchers as they might be able to get you things that are great for your cat but that isn't necessarily or openly sold at the counter.

Anyway, thanks for letting me know which companies to look out for, because there seems to be way too many, and their actual ingredients isn't always readily available in their descriptions, and to be quite honest there is even a disagreement as to what other vitamins should be added in. I thought Prize Choice did not have the vegetables and grains, on their minces. I was thinking of simply adding what vitamins and nutrients is lacking, but if they do have other things there apart from the mince meat and offal and some vitamin mixes, then I guess that crosses it out of my list. I am going to look more into Natural Instinct and Honeys. Is it safe to give him raw food after a week of settling in, and after 15 weeks of being fed on only Royal Canin dry? Of course I'll have to feed it both first and slowly transition into raw food + wet food only.

Yes, of course it is safe. Being a dry raised kitten he might not take to either raw or wet food at first or he might take to either as duck to water.

I think the best solution would be to find out if anyone on these forums who lives in London and feeds raw, and if so, where they are sourcing their meat from?

Yes, there are a few raw feeders on here who live in London. They all have built up good relationships with their butchers.

 

[jasminex]

I know nothing about raw feeding - however I live in London and regularly visit extremely good quality butchers! They aren't cheap though (having said that I've never tried buying offal etc from them, might be as cheap as a cheap thing)

 

[Guest]

This is going to be my first stop for raw feeding:

Products and Prices

You can get taurine powder and garlic capsules (natural flea repellent so I'm told) as well. I've going for the minces along with some chicken carcasses for dental benefits. I cannot BELIEVE how good the chicken wings I've been giving my cats in the week have been for their teeth. I had a cat that was destined for a dental in his life and I checked his teeth last night. They are nearly ALL pearly white!!!

 

[chillminx]

You can get taurine powder and garlic capsules (natural flea repellent so I'm told) as we

Please can I interject a word of warning -- garlic is toxic to cats.
It contains a substance called N-propyl disulphide which destroys the cat's red blood cells causing a condition called Heinz body anaemia.

 

[Alessa]

hobbs2004, I don't mind getting up early (that or I stay up the whole night ) I am glad to know I can switch him to a healthier diet soon, I am just worried about the diarrhea that is supposed to come with switching diet, so I wanted to be really careful about it. I guess I can keep on feeding Royal Canin, gradually change to Orijen within a week, and then have a Natural Instincts raw mince, twice a day with a bit of the Orijen, then see where it goes from there? I should probably try and find the Londoners who feed their cats on raw diet, but would you recommend anyone in particular? Would mixing dry and raw create more problems with stool or is it a linear change wherein the more raw you feed, the better it goes. I think if he likes raw, then I might as well go for that altogether. I've found several suggestions for the perfect mix on here and on other sites, but I want to get used to it first by purchasing NI, and of course finding the right supplier.

Hi jasminex, might poke you about your butchers when I have enough posts to PM. I have O'Shea's near my house but I was never really convinced!

Thanks a lot NexivRed for the link! chilliminx is right, I think garlic is indeed toxic to dogs and cats, so might not be a good idea to mix it, I heard brewers yeast is a natural flea repellant, though? I was thinking of looking into that, and I have seen some people here add that to their raw food mix for their kitties.

 

[Guest]

Wow, thank you. I am going to try to trace my steps and find out where that was suggested as I have definitely read it in a few places.

Won't be putting that on the order then!!! Thanks for the heads up.

 

[hobbs2004]

Please can I interject a word of warning -- garlic is toxic to cats.
It contains a substance called N-propyl disulphide which destroys the cat's red blood cells causing a condition called Heinz body anaemia.

Yes, brewer's yeast might be a better natural choice, provided you don't have a cat with CRF (too high in phosphorus). In addition, the brewer's yeast is a good way to up the intake of b-vitamins and other nutrients.

Personally, I wouldn't touch the DAF minces with a bargepole.