[Sleeping_Lion]

This is so as not to hijack the other thread. I'm genuinely curious, are people aware of the law when allowing their dogs to chase animals birds.

Also, considering the majority of objections about hunting with dogs, is down to the distress caused to the *prey* animal, how is letting dogs chase after wild animals/birds different. For some reason it seems to be natural for pet dogs, but cruel for working dogs in some people's minds, which is genuinely confusing to me?!

 

[missRV]

Here is the link to the training school we're taking Rosie... it says

"The Road Traffic Act - 1971 makes it an offence to let your dog chase or worry livestock"

Maghull & District Dog Training Society provided by Bravenet.com

 

[smokeybear]

I am which is one of the (many) reasons I posted as I did.

I would not like my pets being chased by other animals (including dogs) so why would I allow my dog to this to other animals?

 

[SLB]

I am aware, which is why I try to stop when they chase rabbits. And also that they just flush game, rather than chase. But sometimes I'm not on the ball.

I get your point about hunting with dogs though.. I'm not against it though, providing the prey meets a humane end.

 

[Megan345]

What is the law? I assume you're referring to wild animals, and not livestock?

 

[Sleeping_Lion]

What is the law? I assume you're referring to wild animals, and not livestock?

https://www.gov.uk/hunting-and-the-law

The difficulty is, proving if you were hunting or not, allowing pet dogs to indiscriminately chase wild animals, and sometimes kill them, could be deemed as unlawful.

 

[ballybee]

Both my boys are trained to chase on command, they are also trained to leave anytime during the chase. The reason I chose to train to chase was partly to encourage tracking(both are trained to track for my OH as he shoots and it's necessary to have a dog that can find shot animals) and because with Tumm I found it much easier to train him to chase on command than to leave it, plus we were living on a farm and the farmer asked me if I'd let Tumm chase the birds off his fields before the crops started growing.

I dont like hunting with dogs but do feel as chasing is a natural instinct it needs a safe way to be fulfilled.

ETA - both my boys are never allowed to chase livestock, only gulls and rabbits in safe areas.

 

[tashax]

I imagine that if my rabbit managed to escape (not that he could) but if he did what if someone let their dog chase him?? Or worse catch him?? Someone thought it was funny to let their dog attempt to chase one of my ferrets when i was walking them once, they werent expecting the ferret to bite as hard as she did. I do not allow frey to chase anything what so ever. Causes unnecessary stress to the 'prey' animal and worries me into thinking that she may think it is okay to chase my small furries

 

[Jobeth]

When staying on a farm my older dog managed to chase a chicken. He cornered it and then sat watching. I got his lead back, but the poor chicken was still frozen in fear. I felt dreadful and wouldn't let it happen by choice.

 

[Sleeping_Lion]

Both my boys are trained to chase on command, they are also trained to leave anytime during the chase. The reason I chose to train to chase was partly to encourage tracking(both are trained to track for my OH as he shoots and it's necessary to have a dog that can find shot animals) and because with Tumm I found it much easier to train him to chase on command than to leave it, plus we were living on a farm and the farmer asked me if I'd let Tumm chase the birds off his fields before the crops started growing.

I dont like hunting with dogs but do feel as chasing is a natural instinct it needs a safe way to be fulfilled.

Sorry Ballybee, but I have to disagree. You do not need the presence of a wild animal to teach a dog to track, working trials trainers do it all the time with sausages, and I'm sure they don't run wild round the countryside, or they don't round here Dogs have some natural ability in there to a degree, you build up the rest. Chasing a wild animal/bird out of a hedgerow has little to do with a pricked bird or shot animal whilst out shooting over or working your dogs on a shoot, there are entirely different scents involved. This is why I find it difficult to understand peoples' willingness to allow dogs to chase all and sundry, whether or not they can call their dogs off. Birds/animals still feel the same distress, so why is it ok to practise with your dogs intentionally?

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I've been on training sessions on country where live game is there for people to shoot over their dogs, but I've yet to see a training session where they release animals for dogs to chase, I'm sure that would be counted as cruel, so what's the difference?

 

[Megan345]

https://www.gov.uk/hunting-and-the-law

The difficulty is, proving if you were hunting or not, allowing pet dogs to indiscriminately chase wild animals, and sometimes kill them, could be deemed as unlawful.

Ah yes, I knew that was the case, I just didn't apply it to dogs kept as pets. Mind you, my dogs aren't likely to catch a fox, hare or deer anyway! I think rabbits might be their limit

 

[Sleeping_Lion]

Ah yes, I knew that was the case, I just didn't apply it to dogs kept as pets. Mind you, my dogs aren't likely to catch a fox, hare or deer anyway! I think rabbits might be their limit

I take it you feel a rabbit doesn't have the same fear as any of the other creatures?

Edited to add, perhaps you didn't see the bit about hunting rats and rabbits?

 

[smokeybear]

Both my boys are trained to chase on command, they are also trained to leave anytime during the chase.

Why on earth would you want a dog to chase wildlife on command?

The reason I chose to train to chase was partly to encourage tracking(both are trained to track for my OH as he shoots and it's necessary to have a dog that can find shot animals) and because with Tumm I found it much easier to train him to chase on command than to leave it, plus we were living on a farm and the farmer asked me if I'd let Tumm chase the birds off his fields before the crops started growing.

I am afraid that for tracking the LAST thing we do is encourage dogs to chase wildlife. Dogs that are used to track wounded animals are trained to track using blood, not by chasing animals.

I dont like hunting with dogs but do feel as chasing is a natural instinct it needs a safe way to be fulfilled.

That is why some of us teach our dogs to chase balls, frisbees etc, it is called redirecting their prey drive

ETA - both my boys are never allowed to chase livestock, only gulls and rabbits in safe areas.

So rabbits do not have the right not to be chased then?

 

[hawksport]

With the RSPCA watching the forum I'm thankful for exemptions

 

[Megan345]

I take it you feel a rabbit doesn't have the same fear as any of the other creatures?

Edited to add, perhaps you didn't see the bit about hunting rats and rabbits?

but you can hunt under certain conditions, for example:

hunting rats and rabbits

I'm not going to get into the moral or ethical rights and wrongs of hunting or allowing a dog to chase. Everywhere we walk is too close to roads to let them chase anything anyway. But it does seem to say you can hunt rats and rabbits perfectly legally, I'd guess that's because they're considered vermin.

 

[Sleeping_Lion]

I'm not going to get into the moral or ethical rights and wrongs of hunting or allowing a dog to chase. Everywhere we walk is too close to roads to let them chase anything anyway. But it does seem to say you can hunt rats and rabbits perfectly legally, I'd guess that's because they're considered vermin.

Yes you can hunt rabbits/rats legally, as long as you have all the correct precations in place.

Hunting Act: Legal Guidance: The Crown Prosecution Service

My question is, what difference is it? How is a rabbit or a rat different to a hare or a deer, doesn't a rabbit or a rat feel the same fear?

 

[missnaomi]

The only thing mine are allowed to chase is balls or frisbees.

 

[Sarah1983]

I don't want my dog chasing other animals and do my best to prevent it. I can't guarantee he won't, he took off after a bird while on his long line the other day, that was fun :angry: but I am working on stopping him chasing.

It was never the end of the world to me if Rupert caught a pigeon or a rat or whatever but I'd prefer it not to happen.

 

[ballybee]

My dogs were taught to chase birds and rabbits as I was asked to help keep fields clear of them by a couple of farmers, I don't do it anymore as they had people wanting to shoot and coarse the land instead. I do allow the boys to chase gulls occasionally and before I get my head ripped off again I don't often let them do this as I'm usually using the beach to do some training. My boys are never allowed to chase deer, livestock etc etc.

I do use balls with the boys for chasing, Tummel has only just registered an interest in playing fetch and I'm chuffed to bits.

Spinones were used for tracking and hunting(even holding) wild boar and other animals for the hunters to shoot, no blood tracking there so yes it is important that both Dan and Tummel are able to find a scent and follow it, both can also follow blood trails if needed.

 

[Sleeping_Lion]

My dogs were taught to chase birds and rabbits as I was asked to help keep fields clear of them by a couple of farmers, I don't do it anymore as they had people wanting to shoot and coarse the land instead. I do allow the boys to chase gulls occasionally and before I get my head ripped off again I don't often let them do this as I'm usually using the beach to do some training. My boys are never allowed to chase deer, livestock etc etc.

I do use balls with the boys for chasing, Tummel has only just registered an interest in playing fetch and I'm chuffed to bits.

Spinones were used for tracking and hunting(even holding) wild boar and other animals for the hunters to shoot, no blood tracking there so yes it is important that both Dan and Tummel are able to find a scent and follow it, both can also follow blood trails if needed.

I'm sorry you feel people are 'ripping your head off' I think it's just how things come across on the internet, I certainly didn't mean for you to feel that way.

I trained my girls to track, Indie and Tau, and they never chased a wild animal to instill this ability, it was always a case of encouraging them to get their nose on the ground, and I can promise you we never rubbed wild rabbits or game birds randomly anywhere to encourage them to track, it was the humble hot dog.