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Dog Training and Behaviour Discuss dog training and behaviour problems in this section. Are you having problems with your dogs behaviour? Then submit your problems and get help from other members. Do you have some excellent dog training advice? then submit your details here to help others.

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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 29-05-2011, 06:28 AM
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Re: Consequences

Quote:
Originally Posted by catz4m8z View Post
Hannah has a habit of 'doing her own thing' sometimes and I just reward her the same!! She never goes far but if she is on a sniffing mission at the park I just wait with the other 2 and give her a few minutes before I call her back so Im not standing there like a loon calling and calling!!
Have you thought of trying using the distraction of the sniffing which she loves, as the reward? So turn it round, rather than try and call her away from sniffing; call her to you, then say "go sniff" and make the trip to the sniffing spot real fun?

On the proofing & dog not listening, whilst it's true; It's probably got some good reasons for it, especially in "family" dogs, rather than those with expert highly motivated owners.

Mistakes I make when relaxed and having fun out & about, are unclear garbled cues; occasionally I even say the wrong cue, and where it's stupid, I can hardly blame the dog for a "come again?" puzzled look. At other times, he's figured out something new, by generalising a command to a new situation, so if you do this, shutting up and letting the dog work it out, might work, rather than babbling a "whoops!" and interrupting the canine problem solving.

At times to, someone else has affected the dog, so you need to make it easier; or you misjudged the distraction level.

We learn not when we are 100% successful, but when we are unafraid to makes some mistakes, but then respond by addressing the exposed weaknesses; this is an essential attitude for success in competitive technical sports. The variable reinforcement idea, becomes useful according to the experts at 80% success rate and speeds reliability, so avoiding failure too much would be another handler error.
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For eager & reliable recall, be fun for the dog to come back to! Then often send them off right away to do what they wanted!
DT&B - Glossary of acronyms & jargon terms.
Encouraging good behaviours, whilst consistently avoiding practise of bad alternatives leads to extinction of the bad. So if dog sits 6/10 times it doesn't sit 4/10 times, encouraging with the right rewards (positively-reinforcing) enough for 9/10 times means it now fails to sit only 1/10 times, sit 10/10 means...
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old 29-05-2011, 07:28 AM
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Re: Consequences

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Originally Posted by RAINYBOW View Post
MMmmm i do see the point but to be honest he should just be grateful i dont march him straight down to the rescue centre ((joke))

For him to get absolutely no reward from me it would have to be one of his spectacular BOG OFFS (which are thankfully infrequent) and in these instances i will have long given up any sort of recalling as i cannot compete with the reward of what he is doing.

To be honest when he has been in "that zone" the best course is to put him back on because his adrenalin is such that i have lost him in terms of any focus and he is likely to do it again i allowed to simply continue the fun.

He is generally pretty exhausted too

His recall has steadily improved over time and part of me kind of accepts (rightly or wrongly) that he needs to exhibit this behaviour sometimes
I was always taught, when a dog returns to you, get your hands on him and at least stroke him along the back once. Increase praise depending on the quickness of return. So quick return high praise - slow return, just a quick stroke of the back. Even if he has ignored you and gone on walk about.
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Old 29-05-2011, 07:33 AM
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Re: Consequences

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Originally Posted by CarolineH View Post
I've really given this one some thought and I am afraid that I agree with lemmsy. I really cannot think of the last time I had that problem with a dog ignoring commands. I am not saying that to 'brag', it just does not happen because I train my dogs thoroughly by increasing distractions around them and rewarding for the correct response. They have learned that I am the best thing around, not other dogs, horses, cats or other people etc. Once I have 'proofed' them in this way then they are allowed more off lead time as I know they will always come to me and not go galloping off to do something else. If they go wrong then it is MY fault as I have pushed them too hard and too fast and they need a bit more time and a bit more training.

In 29 years of actually owning my own dogs, I have just not had one that has 'done its own thing'? I started to teach myself about dog training 38 years ago and learned very early on (from other dog trainers I met on the park!) about proofing stays, proofing recalls etc etc before allowing a pup to run off ahead on it's own.
Me either, this is a general question for general discussion and hopefully simplifies the R+ /-P debate going on, on other threads. By sticking to simple answers.
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Old 29-05-2011, 01:04 PM
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Re: Consequences

Well if you're in the punishment/negative-reinforcment camp, maths & logic does not support your case, so I can understand that urge.

The maths is easy - Simple Proof that positively-reinforcing a behaviour simultaneously negatively-punishes (diminishes) alternative behaviours.
__________________
For eager & reliable recall, be fun for the dog to come back to! Then often send them off right away to do what they wanted!
DT&B - Glossary of acronyms & jargon terms.
Encouraging good behaviours, whilst consistently avoiding practise of bad alternatives leads to extinction of the bad. So if dog sits 6/10 times it doesn't sit 4/10 times, encouraging with the right rewards (positively-reinforcing) enough for 9/10 times means it now fails to sit only 1/10 times, sit 10/10 means...
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