Behaviorists advice please...

Mrsbirnie · #1 (**permalink**) 24-09-2008, 06:08 PM

I have a Sporting Lucas Terrier, similar build to a JRT, but not as feisty, named Jinnie, the problem I have with her is she flares up at other dogs when we are out for our walks, she is fine with my mums dog, but any other dog, she starts growling, tail goes upright and she is "alert", if I let her close enough she does the sniffing thing, then lunges for them, she has never made contact with any dog, and sometimes I wonder would she bite or is she doing amateur dramatics, but frankly I'm not risking another persons dog being bitten by mine, I grew wise to this lunging carry on very quickly, and have her on the lead (and extending one) at all times, I am one of those people who believes dogs should be on a lead unless your in a secure area where no other dogs or people will be about, as not everyone is dog friendly.

If I see a dog approaching I lock her on the shortest possible so if she does kick up a fuss I can control her, well as best as I can and give said dog and owner a wide birth, it's horrid cos she sounds like a vicious dog, and she is anything but, she's brilliant with kids, cats, just not strange dogs. She seems better at following dogs, but even with that sometimes she is a grumpy sod, but its the crossing paths with a dog that she really cannot handle, even across a road she gets heckled. I understand this behavior is her trying to protect me, I have tried numerous methods to get her to stop, being calm and ignoring, a tug to the side with the lead to distract her, firm "No's", stopping our walk till she calms down, but that doesn't really work cos she only calms down when the dog is no longer in sight, tried shouting

at her but goes right over the top of her head, I just do not understand why she is like this, I could understand if she had been attacked by a dog but she hasn't, she used to be fine with other dogs up till the age of about 1, which coincides with when my mum got her dog, we thought she took on the protective role with my mums dog being a baby, and it seems to have spiraled from then on, as before then she was fine with other dogs, playful, not a growl in sight.

"Dogpositivetraining" I took some of the advice you gave in another thread about someones JRT with my dog today, the giving of treats to distract her when another dog is there, and keep plying her with the treats to keep her focus on me and the biscuits and not whats going on around her i.e. the other dog, and lots of "good girl" in my "happy your a good dog voice", and it seemed to work, we actually ended up walking at the same pace about a metre and a half away from the lady and her Westie for a bit, then I ran out of treats, but by then she was alright with the other dog being there, baby steps, got a tub of treats to have in my car for walks so I don't run out in future, will continue with it and see how we go, but if you or anyone has any other advice on how to make her a happier dog, or to help me understand why she has gone like this...anything really, please advise away.

Thanks in advance

Lambchop · #2 (**permalink**) 24-09-2008, 08:38 PM

Nope, you sound to be handling it very well to me. If you think you find the situation gets out of hand the best option is to remove yourself and your dog from the situation in a calm manner. Keep going, your doing a cracking job!

Mrsbirnie · #3 (**permalink**) 24-09-2008, 09:27 PM

Thanks, I just find it frustrating, my mums dog was a year old in April (same breed, same dad different mums), she is fine with other dogs, doesn't bat an eyelid, eager to meet, greet and play, even with Jinnie near by bouncing around like a crazy thing and growling.

Jyp (mums dog) is not without her own faults though, her list is endless LOL, but we're clinging onto the fact she's still a young un', but *whispers* alot of it is cos my mum is lousy at disciplining her and tends not to follow through, to be honest I'm quite glad Jinnie doesn't have the faults Jyp has as bar this thing with other dogs I can honestly say she is perfect.

*edited in*
The other thing that annoys me is how some people let their dogs come up to her, often running full tilt, even when I have clearly said to the owner that she has some issues, and isn't good with other dogs! I can control Jinnie as I am responsible and have her on a lead, but it's bloody hard when their dogs loose off the lead sniffing about at her! With her being so small and nimble she can contort herself around so quickly, I worry she will have a pop at the dog, I love all dogs, but owners annoy me with the attitude of "my dogs friendly they won't harm you"! All dogs are unpredictable, no one can guarantee their dog is going to behave in every situation, even mine I'm no fool, hence why I keep her on a lead so that if anything ever does happen, I can control her, but how do I control her with another dog friendly or not sniffing/barking/getting in her face making it worse.

Mini rant over LOL!!

fun4fido · #4 (**permalink**) 25-09-2008, 08:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mrsbirnie

I have a Sporting Lucas Terrier, similar build to a JRT, but not as feisty, named Jinnie, the problem I have with her is she flares up at other dogs when we are out for our walks, she is fine with my mums dog, but any other dog, she starts growling, tail goes upright and she is "alert", if I let her close enough she does the sniffing thing, then lunges for them, she has never made contact with any dog, and sometimes I wonder would she bite or is she doing amateur dramatics, but frankly I'm not risking another persons dog being bitten by mine, I grew wise to this lunging carry on very quickly, and have her on the lead (and extending one) at all times, I am one of those people who believes dogs should be on a lead unless your in a secure area where no other dogs or people will be about, as not everyone is dog friendly.

If I see a dog approaching I lock her on the shortest possible so if she does kick up a fuss I can control her, well as best as I can and give said dog and owner a wide birth, it's horrid cos she sounds like a vicious dog, and she is anything but, she's brilliant with kids, cats, just not strange dogs. She seems better at following dogs, but even with that sometimes she is a grumpy sod, but its the crossing paths with a dog that she really cannot handle, even across a road she gets heckled. I understand this behavior is her trying to protect me, I have tried numerous methods to get her to stop, being calm and ignoring, a tug to the side with the lead to distract her, firm "No's", stopping our walk till she calms down, but that doesn't really work cos she only calms down when the dog is no longer in sight, tried shouting

at her but goes right over the top of her head, I just do not understand why she is like this, I could understand if she had been attacked by a dog but she hasn't, she used to be fine with other dogs up till the age of about 1, which coincides with when my mum got her dog, we thought she took on the protective role with my mums dog being a baby, and it seems to have spiraled from then on, as before then she was fine with other dogs, playful, not a growl in sight.

"Dogpositivetraining" I took some of the advice you gave in another thread about someones JRT with my dog today, the giving of treats to distract her when another dog is there, and keep plying her with the treats to keep her focus on me and the biscuits and not whats going on around her i.e. the other dog, and lots of "good girl" in my "happy your a good dog voice", and it seemed to work, we actually ended up walking at the same pace about a metre and a half away from the lady and her Westie for a bit, then I ran out of treats, but by then she was alright with the other dog being there, baby steps, got a tub of treats to have in my car for walks so I don't run out in future, will continue with it and see how we go, but if you or anyone has any other advice on how to make her a happier dog, or to help me understand why she has gone like this...anything really, please advise away.

Thanks in advance

Hi,

I know how frustrating this can be, but in these situations you should always try to remain calm, never shout at your Lucas Terrier, or jerk on her lead, simply because this will only make it worse.

Dogs will display aggression for various reasons, but 90% of the time it is due to fear, fear of its resources being under threat (therefore protecting the resources provider, you), fear due to not having enough contact with lots of dogs during the important socialisation period, or fear down to lack of confidence with other dogs. In general these dogs will also have a low stress threshold, so this threshold needs to be increased.

Whatever the reason, it only makes the situation worse if the owner get angry, shouts, or it not calm. As this reaction will increase the stress.

I know you haven't been doing this, but I thought I would explain this for the benefit of others as well, hope you don't mind

I'm glad you read my other post and have tried giving treats, with consistency this will work.

At home with no distractions teach your dog to sit and give you eye contact. I'll assume she already knows sit, so start off with eye contact. You can either lure the behaviour by holding a treat in front of her nose and then in a smooth movement move the treat up an imaginary piece of string to your eyes. Or you can wait until she offers you the behaviour, either way, treat AS she does the behaviour, and then a bonny "Good girl", give treat, neck rub etc.

Keep doing this until she has that "Aha!" moment and understands that to get the treat she must make eye contact with you.

Now is the time to introduce your verbal cue so as she makes eye contact (timing is vital here), say "look". Then follow up with "good girl" and a treat.

When you think she is performing this behaviour well, ask her to "look" pause "sit", then "good girl" and treat.

This can be done in one day at home, split in to short 10 minutes sessions.

For the next couple of weeks when you go walking try to stick to routes where you will be able to give your dog a wide birth, (ooh that sounds painful, a wide berth even :-D ), so no narrow passings.

Transport permitting, it is best to jump in a car and take your dog to an open field where you will encounter other dogs.

Stock up on treats, wear a treats pouch/bag for easy access to the treats.

I would suggest switching from an extending lead to a strong leather 3/4ft lead.

Initially keep her at a distance from others dogs where possible, but as soon as she see/hears another dog, get her attention by calling her name in a bright voice, then ask her to "look" pause "sit" then "good girl" and treat. Keep saying "look" and give treat, until the event (seeing or hearing another dog) has passed.

The intention is to keep doing this while increasing the proximity to other dogs.

I would suggest if you have a friend with a well-behaved dog, it is best to create meeting/approaching scenarios in a garden. Before attempting such close proximity with other dogs on walks.

Also as I suggested to the other member, group classes would be very beneficial.

Hope this helps.

Mrsbirnie · #5 (**permalink**) 25-09-2008, 06:58 PM

Have printed off your tips and am off downstairs now to start the "look" training.

Thanks for your help, will let you know how we get on.

Mrsbirnie · #6 (**permalink**) 25-09-2008, 09:16 PM

She seems to be getting the "look" thing....will see how our walk goes tomorrow with the treat distraction...I bet we don't see any dogs LOL!!

fun4fido · #7 (**permalink**) 26-09-2008, 04:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mrsbirnie

She seems to be getting the "look" thing....will see how our walk goes tomorrow with the treat distraction...I bet we don't see any dogs LOL!!

Great!

Just build up the proximity slowly, so try to keep a distance between her and other dogs for now, but make sure she can see and/or hear them.

Hope it goes well.

Mrsbirnie · #8 (**permalink**) 26-09-2008, 07:15 AM

Thanks....well mannered dog here we come.....*hopes*

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