Am I being over sensitive? Hubby and son took our nearly 6 month old sbt to training classes that have been recommended. I took him to the same one before Christmas and personally thought the lady used too much pulling and shouting so hubby said he would go and try it out.

Anyway, our puppy is lovely and can do the basic commands - sit, stay, down and mostly come. We use treats and ignoring on the whole as training tools and they seem to be working. Anyway our little fellow is very excitable when he meets new dogs and people. He is friendly and can go into a bit of a frenzy. We have been training him to sit when in that situation which on the whole seems to work. But last night the trainer had my son walking him up and down on the lead, he wasn't managing very well (he is 10), so she came over, took him off my son to show him, puppy mounted her and it all decended into chaos. Now in that same situation I would have expected her to get him to sit but she pulled dog off of her, said he was out of control and said we needed to get a chocker chain.

I think this was most unhelpful, and my son was very unhappy. I do not want them to go back but on the other hand other dogs there are very well behaved so are we in fact deluded?

Please help.

I think you're completely right to not want to go back there!!!

Why are the other dogs so good? probably because they're too scared to do anything else!!The sad fact is, punishment does seem to work in the short term, but it doesn't make for a happy dog as the dog isn't learning because it wants to it's just working to avoid something nasty.

Find yourself a new training class, that uses positive training methods, and perhaps suggest the trainer wears a choke collar herself to prevent her stupid ideas from coming out.

You don't need to use a choke chain to train a dog I would find another class.

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I would agree with you....although my pooches are gundogs and we use slip leads. If you are not happy go to differnet classes, on your walks ask other dog walkers for recommendations and your vet.

Keep up the good work sounds as though you are doing well enough with out the classes

I'd personally not go back there. That was a disgusting way to treat a dog and to talk to you. He is not 'out of control' by the sounds of it. Just an excitable pup that maybe needs steering into learning manners of how to greet people.


I'd never use a choke chain unless it was a last resort, some people keep telling me Duke needs one. I would like a dog that can walk on a loose lead without the need of being aggresive. I don't care if the dog is at my heel or behind me, what I want is a loose lead.

I don't know how you've been trying to teach your pup but I've done alot of things with Duke such as

Walking in the opposite direction when he gets too excitable or pulls
Ignoring and jerking the lead saying "come on come on"

At the moment I am, if there's a dog, making sure Duke has his back to them (I use cheese for this or chicken) and get Duke to lay down. As soon as he lays down I let him off the lead to greet, and I think a good way of teaching manners of how rough he can be is letting the other dog tell him with his body language.

There was a border collie once that Duke charged up to, to say hello (I knew the owner and dog). The collie turned and snapped him, one of those bite in the air things and growled a bit at him. Duke now knows if he sees that dog he doesn't run up, he walks up calmly to him to say hello. Other dogs he tends to run up to, I only do this really with dogs he's met before and owners I know.

The Humping could be just because he was so excited. So I wouldn't worry too much about that, just talk him out on plenty of walks. Lots of mental stimulation to help you two bond. I play games with Duke sometimes, I hide treats under cups and see if he can sniff them out, he sounds like a helicopter but I tend to find the more time I spend with him just bonding, the more he listens to me.

If you can, watch some of the It's Me Or The Dog. Often Victoria Stillwell comes across dogs that overgreet and she uses some techniques that you can adapt to your dog. Such as 'place', closing the door, repeating etc.

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I agree, stay away.

When Kite was little I had to keep going to Nottingham to work on my late mother's house. I took both dogs to a training class there a couple of times, to keep up with Zig's agility and do more basic stuff with Kite. I've never seen so many choke chains! The second time the class started off with the 'trainer' throwing water in her own dog's face to get it under control - I thought then she had nothing to teach me. After the class I stopped in this pet supply store across the road, and a man from the class came in, he'd been told to buy a choke chain for his lab puppy. Me, the shop owner and someone else persuaded him not to. I didn't go back.

You'd be better off buying a clicker and a book on clicker training.

Thank you all so much - just been for lovely calm walk in park for half an hour. Met two dogs, did well, no pulling and such a happy boy!

Definitely not going back! It was the way she spoke to my son that really annoyed me. He is great with our dog and she made him feel pants.

We love 'It's me or the dog', he gets three walks a day with plenty of socialisation and variety. But we will find another class - and I will start looking for recommendations straight away.

And to be honest it is just the fact that he is so excitable that we need to manage - we have a very busy house with lots of coming and goings which we can control, he is house-trained, etc. It is when we meet new people outside. But we will carry on the sit to greet - although I will try getting him to face me. But at the same time I also do not want to kill that enthusiasm for new people and dogs as it it great for him to have as many experiences as possible when he is young.

Thank you, thank you, thank you

This is why I don't like the idea of training classes. You get people who have been doing the job for donkey's years and they don't keep up to date with new research, and even if they did they would still think they know better. From what I have read a lot of these people just want to show off how clever they are.

You seem to be doing ok on your own, so why change? Keep watching Victoria; she knows what she is doing. You know that in a lot of her programmes she has turned up to find the owners using choke chains and has immediately said: That is going in the trash.

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Yes SBTs can be stubborn and strong willed, but at 6mths he is still a pup, at his age 6/14 mths they can go through a fear of the unknown period, where even curious outgoing pups can revert to acting to sights,sounds and situations again with fear. Reprimanding and scolding and things like choke chains can make them fearful and nervous. They do go through a period too
where they do try to assert their freedom and want to socialise with other dogs and many dont recall, if they did before.

Treating them harshly and forcing them to do things can ruin trust and association. It can if they are slightly nervous types already anyway, turn them into fear agressive dogs. The only training should be firm but fair consistent training thats reward based.

Forcing, Jerking and using choke chains, is the sign of an inadequate lazy trainer, I would give her/his classes a the wide berth.

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As others have said, forget the choke chain! would NEVER use one on a pupster anyway - perhaps it may be worth looking foe another training class!