Hi I have recently posted before and am following all the advice but unfortunately another more serious problem.
I have a 14 month cross pappillion dog im not sure what he is crossed with some kind of terrier i think. All I know about his background is he has been with a family then sold to a breeder for the sole purpose of breeding. when I first got him two weeks ago he was very nervous and hadnt been house trained this i am working on and seeing some results at last. The problem I now have is although he has settled in really well and is very affectionate and follows me everywhere, there are two visitors who visit regulary he dislikes one being my sister who is mentally retarded. He growls all the time they are here and soon as they try to walk he goes for there feet. I suspect he has been kicked in the past but I cant understand why its just these two people he does it too, everyone else he is fine his like a different dog. I have tried everything I can think of like getting them to give him a treat when they come in, putting him on a lead and sitting in the same room as the person but he growls the whole time. Today the other guest was here for two hrs the dog was fine then all of a sudden when the guest got up the dog went for him. I really need help with this he is such a lovely dog otherwise but I cant have him biting anyone can anyone help? I might add he has not been neutered yet i am hoping to get this done soon.

Hi - my friend has a terrier who growled at his young lad when he was little . . . Now that his lad is older and can grab the dog by the scruff there is no more problem and the dog respects and loves the boy. I think sometimes small dog owners don't want to make their baby uncomfortable - a simple correction of the behaviour might help. It would help even more if your guests had the confidence to try it.
My friend's dog was a JRT

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Regards, Jim (28)

Hi thanks for the quick reply the thing is he is not just growling he is actually going for their feet and could give a serious bite if they wasnt wearing shoes. Of course they are also becoming very wary now of being bitten. The thing is I dont know any simple correction. I have tried to get my guests to give him a treat, tell him No turn their backs etc.

OMG- now the boy is older he grabs the dog by the scruff! How horrid
If he's grabbing the dog by the scruff I very much doubt he is that bonded with him! Think about it, as far as the dog is concerned, one minute the boy is ok with him, next minute he scruffs him. Could you honestly ever be totally at ease with a person if that was the situation.

A growl is a warning. I'd be pleased the dog is growling and letting you know that he's not comfortable. When a dog growls, you need to look at the situation and look at how or why the dog has become worried and identify triggers. You then initially limit or prevent his exposure to these triggers and then eventually work on counter-conditioning his emotional response to them.

If you ignore a growl (the dog telling you he's not comfortable with something) and do nothing about it (or EVEN worse, correct the dog for growling ), if the dog is then put into such a situation that he cannot cope with he may well bite.
Seriously DO NOT USE CORRECTIONS. This will not help and may well worsen the problem.
Think about it:-

You have a fear of spiders. And you're put into a situation where there are 3 giant spiders in the room. At first you are able to find somewhere to hide but then your friend (who you are with), pulls you out of the hiding place and pushes you towards them and tells to to "say hello". You shout "NO. I'm not comfortable with that!" but your friend tells you not to be so rude and that you're an idiot, jabs you in the neck and tries to push you towards the giant spiders. Again you shout "NO. I don't like this!" and the friend once again tells you off and pushes you towards the spiders. This happens again and again. You're getting more and more stressed and just can't cope. Again your friend jabs you in the neck with his forefingers and pushes you towards the spiders. But this time you're just so stressed out that you flip and charge towards the spiders, fists flying in all directions, gritted teeth and you start to go for them (then retreat as soon as possible back to your hiding place)!

Did the friend pulling you out of your hiding place help you?
Did the friend ignoring your requests and jabbing you in the neck help you get over your fear?
No of course not!!!!!- it made you 10 times worse and left you with no option to aggress before anyone would actually listen to you!

It never fails to shock me how, with aggressive/reactive behaviours in dogs, people consistently fail to consider the key element in fear-based responses:
EMOTIONAL STATES.
(and the chemical changes in the brain that are associated with these responses)

You do NOT cure a fear (a negative emotion) by conditioning the feared stimulus with a "correction". I'm pretty sure that if I was put in a situation that I wasn't happy with and I (albeit loudly) shouted that I wasn't happy and a companion, slapped me round the face every time I acted defensively when the feared stimulus was there, I'd get a heck of a lot worse!

OK so that was a long ramble. BUT seriously DO NOT correct a growl!!!!!

OP- your dog has had a stressful life. It sounds as though from what you say, his previous owners haven't been to kind to him.
He is obviously very stressed with the situation of you sister and co coming into the house.
I suggest that in the short term you put him in another room or behind a stairgate while they are round. Just let him chill in there and don't expose him to it. In the short term prevention of rehearsal and reinforcement of the fear-based reaction is vital.

One factor is, as you mentioned that your sister is disabled, your dog may well be able to read this? Dogs (and particularly fearful ones) are often more worried by humans that have a strange gait for example or who hold their body differently- this may well be what is spooking and scaring him.

In the meantime, whenever they come round please keep him in another room, where they will not go and no one can bother him. Perhaps leave him in his bed or crate with a stuffed kong to keep him chilled (chewing, eating etc is stress relieving too as this may well help him to relax a little). Also if they come regularly and he is consistently given a kong in his bed upon their arrival, and he can hear their voices, there may be the possibility of the added advantage of him beginning to associate their voices and arrival with a yummy kong toy!
However, what is vitally important is keeping him SAFE!

I suggest you contact a behaviourist who can help you with this. I would highly recommend a behaviourist who ONLY used positive reinforcement techniques (no aversives or dominance)!

Organizations such as the APBC and APDT are good:
Welcome to APDT - Association of Pet Dog Trainers UK
The APBC | Association of Pet Behaviour Counsellors

Whereabouts are you based? Someone may be able to recommend a decent behaviourist?

Best of luck

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I know you dont know much about your dogs history, but if I remember correctly he lived with a large family of 7? and then was sold on and kept isolated in a kennel for breeding originally, for 2mths and then sold on to you?
So without knowing the full details it probably doesnt take much working out that none of it was particularly good.

If he is fine with everyone else except these two people then obviously there must be something about them that triggers a response for some reason maybe he reminds them of someone in his past and he clearly feels unease and anxiousness around them. One of my recues had a fear of men with grey hair for some reason when I first got her many years ago.

In the case of your sister I dont know the extent of her special needs, but I know depending on the extent of their dissabilities some can make sudden sounds and movements that can be unccordinated, if this is the case with your sister? Im wondering if he is anxious around her for this reason. He may fell threatned and unsure. Does she try to stroke him or go up to him and make contact with hiim? If he is unsure of her he may see it as a threat especially as you said he is nervous anyway. Is it possible that you can tell her to totally ignore the dog and see if in his own time he will settle in her presence. I would also put his crate or bed in a corner of the room as far away as possible so he has somewhere to retreat too if he feels the need.
If you havent a crate have you a table you can put his bed under so he has a safe den.

With your other visitor his unsure of too, I would tell them to totally ignore the dog, no approaching him going to touch him, speaking to him or eye contact. If he does show any curiosity then make sure they have been pre given treats and still ignoring him completely tell them to throw treats in his direction, working up if you can so he comes nearer at his pace if he is going to to get the treats. See if eventually he will take one but tell them to still not touch speak or talk to him. Then see if they can speak to him softly,without touching or eye contact, once and if he seems at ease,then see if he will accept touch, then finally eye contact as well. Dont push any stage, even if they never make complete contact with him and he just settles in the same room and if its even only ever in his den safe area then at least its progress to what you have now.

If he does accept them then you will probably find the pouncing when they get up to go may well stop, however if the leaving remains a problem you can remove him from the room before they even move to get up, just put him in another room, they can then leave without the problem.

I think if they or you do any rough handling as has been suggested, it will just make an even worse association with these two people than he has now.
If he is anxious for whatever reason, then a fearful nervous dog can and will likely bite. No guarantees on my suggestions of course, but its aimed at making positive association with these two people. Its not an immediate fix and you will have to do it in stages at his pace.

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yeah thats it give the dog food for growling. I recently tried this while a friends dog stayed over. It certainly did NOT work with him and i was bitten twice. Their owner gave me permission to hold the dog down if he growled at me and this solved the problem. He would not dare do it now and is behaving better at home . . .
Not everything can be fixed with a treat !

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Regards, Jim (28)

The boy in question has been told to do this by his father, who has had a JRT all his life. The boy and dog are very well bonded, Max has never bitten tommy EVER even though they wrestle on the floor frequently. Both enjoy themselves and Max knows if he growls he gets put outside straight away . . . I don't see how this is a problem tommy picking him up by the scruff - it's the safest way to stop him getting too excited
Perhaps it won't be a good idea in this other case, but they are asking for last resort stuff here aren't they ? To stop an attack happening . . .

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Regards, Jim (28)

You dont give the dog food for growling you give it for calm required behaviour actually only.

But Hey Ive only got nearly 20yrs, experience and picked up and dealt with stressed frightened rescue dogs, plus handled a pack of 12/14 sibes on several occasions and covered a rescue kennel a couple of times so WTF would I know.

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If the father told the boy to do so, he is asking for trouble IMO. Very foolish thing to do (J)IMO.
Grabbing the dog by the scruff will not stop an "attack" happening, it will provide the trigger for one The dog may not have bitten yet but if they continue to rough handle him like that, especially if he has growled to warn them off, one day the dog will NOT be so good about it and will bite.
I think I'd start to get defensive it people starting pulling me around by my hair every time I told them I was really uncomfortable with something.

And of course, when that poor dog does finally snap, he'll be the one who ends up either subjected to even more aversive/dominance rubbish and set up to fail further or PTS!

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If you read the posts through again you do not give the dog food for growling.
-First of all you limit exposure to the trigger so that the dog is not given the opportunity to rehearse or reinforce the fear based reaction.
- Once the dog is comfortable and happy at this stage you will begin to work on very gradually increasing the dog's exposure to the situation, setting him or her up for success and each stage and rewarding a calm non-reactive response.
This is a very gradual process known as systematic-desensitization and counter-conditioning. I would elaborate on the stages that this could be broken down in, however I think it would be best of the OP to have a decent behaviourist see the dog and work out a plan together, so that at each stage the dog is set up to succeed- this will ultimately help the dog to get over her fears.

However as for the whole "rewarding a dog for growling" idea. I think tripod may well have already explained this in a previous thread:

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You mentioned you tried feeding a friends dog who growled at you. Why did he growl at you? What was the trigger?
Because you were bitten twice- the dog was obviously over threshold and was forced to bite in a situation he couldn't deal with.

It's not a case of the dog "daring" to do something or daring to growl. That's far to simplistic an explanation.
You do not gain respect from a dog by pinning him or scruffing him. That'll only teach him not to trust you!

Truth is behaviour modification is far more complex than any kind of notion of respect or dominance, it's about identifying triggers, no matter how slight they may be and controlling such triggers in a way that allows the dog to succeed and not to rehearse their fear-related response. Fear and fear based reactions are caused by issues with emotion (fear is a negative emotion) and therefore the complex chemical changes in the brain that are involved with this. In order to modify a fearful dog's behaviour you need to change their perception of the feared stimulus as well as, in many cases, reducing other stressors in the dogs life.

Hope that makes a bit more sense

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