Hello

In June we got a Border Collie puppy from a reliable breeder (she breeds champion dogs and has had Border Collies all her life - she realy knows them!). The puppy is now 4 months old. All the time that she was "house-bound" ie. hadn't had her vaccinations, she was wonderful and sociable with anyone who came in the house and any vaccinated dogs that she met (ours, friends ect.). However the problem started soon after she first started going out in public - she barks and snaps and growls at literally everythingperson or dog that she sees. Her ears go flat and her barking is the threatening aggresive type, not playful. She is perfectly friendly with the 4 people in our household (two adults, two daughters) and our other 3 dogs (a leonburger, springer and jack russel - all good natured and have never had aggression problems or anything). When the puppy tries to attack other dogs, these dogs don't try to attack her back or bark back at her - they just walk on and ignore her. We have been told by lots of people that Border Collies are generally hard work and snappy anyway, but shouldn't be this aggresive this young. The puppy is actually owned by our youngest daughter who is 11 - she trained her well and wants to do agility with her (it's been her life-long dream). We did think that maybe the puppy was protecting our daughter, but soon realised that the aggresion and attacking happens even when our daughter isn't around. Another person suggested that it might be some form of jelousy. We have met up with the breeder a few times, and the puppy has gone for her too, and she knows how to handle Border Collies better than anyone we know! We have tryed taking the puppy out everywhere to get it used to people and other dogs, but as soon as she sees someone she launches herself at them, barking and snapping and growling. She has bitten a few people already (thankfully they were dog people and honestly didn't mind), but we dont know what we'll do when she bites someone who does mind. We're at a complete loss at what to do, we've bought hundreds of puppy help book and border collie books and gone to training classes and everything, but nothing seems to be changing her. The last thing we want to do is have to get rid of her.

Does anyone have any ideas or experienced this before?


Ella

i know people are not gonna like this.

i would put a choke chain on her and when she does the snapping give her a good hard yank and a very load NO.
or i would even use a lemon spray collar.

our tess used to be quite snappy she got the treatment and is a lot better but being a collie, she still on the odd times snaps at my other dogs so gets and quick slap on these odd times.

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Dont do anything until you have spoken to a good reweard based behaviourist preferably one with a good stooge dog. Anything you do may have adverse effects and could make the situation worse. I would go with slow introductions to strange people and then to strange dogs, preferably a stooge as these are better at comunicating with dogs in general and will ignore her bad behaviours which will calm her down. Sorry I cant be much help but with out seeing it myself, I cant really provide much info for you. A good behaviourist in your area should be able to help tho.

I wouldnt say all border collies are hard work and snappy ... Toffee definately isnt and neither was my Bud

as for your problem it could be that she's scared and its coming out as aggression

I def wouldnt use choke chains or sprays on her though , you dont want a dog that is only doing what you say through fear of punishment
Plus she is way too young for such harsh treatment
Positive training is the way to go

do you maybe have a friend (she doesnt know) that you could, over a period of time , introduce her to only outside ?

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Who's the breeder?

Hello
Thank you to everyone who has replied.

We first got her outside socialising as soon as her last vaccine - so at 10 weeks. However, she had met other friendly dogs before that (our friends dogs who we know well). Earlier today we tried taking her out with one person and the rest of us walking around and meeting up with her to see her reaction to someone outside who she actually knew. For all of us she barked furiously and was quite aggressive, but when we got to about 3m away from her she recognised us and turned friendly and happy to see us. However, whenever someone came along who she didn't know, she went back to her earlier behavior

We were told to try out a tin can filled with beads to shake above her head whenever this happened, but she ignored it, wasn't frightned of it at all. Our neighbour thinks that we should try a nicer approach to her behaviour - he suggested that when she barked and attaced people so stand infront of her and look her in the eyes or stroke her calmly or something, but we've had so much mixed advice that we don't know what path to take.

I am the "alpha male" of the other three dogs, but not to the Border Collie, and I realise now that the puppy's aggression may be something to do with being confused that the other three dogs see me as their leader and she thinks that she has to see my daughter as the leader. How can I change her view of an 11 year old being the leader and make her follow the other dogs? She never looks any of us in the eye so its dificult to get her attention.

Ella

hello is she being walked with your other dogs and if so what is their reaction? I have threedogs my youngest a fifteen month old male rottweiler he has learnt a hell of a lot from my two oldies about the right and wrong way to behave and looks up to them to show the way so as to speak. Im wondering if your pup hasnt made that bond with your other dogs. I would also like to add that I do take them out individially as well for play and training sessions.I have to agree also that an eleven year old is not mature enough to be in charge and if I was you I would find a well recommended behaviourist to come out and do an assesment.Why I say come to your house is as you have a multi-pet household the behaviourist would need to see the whole picture.Good luck let us know what happens.

My parents have mainly had border collies.

I can only say what I would and have done: -

1. They need stimulation, as they soon get bored.

2. Join a puppy class group, your vet will probably know a local dog training centre.

3. I wouldn't advise a choke chain our border collies have been long coated and their fur will get caught but there is an alternative check collar.

I used to stand still and make my dog wait until whatever is bothering him has passed. Talking and reassuring him. Whether it be another dog, vehicle, person jogging or cycling.

Border Collies as you probably know have a strong working drive and will herd anything.


Sue

Thank you

Yes, she started this behaviour as soon as she was out in public at 10 weeks.

I'm about to go out and walk down the road with her - i'll try ignoring her and being calm when her aggressive behavoir sets in.

When we walk her with our other dogs they take no notice when she barks at people and other dogs around - the other dogs also dont seem bothered by it.

Ella