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13-08-2008, 08:44 AM
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Re: Water spray
I have never myself owned a dog before, (I was brought up with a dog that was absolutely brilliant). I saw this method in the RSPCA training book and assumed that this was a well thought of method. (Clearly I was wrong), I brought Bailey home last Friday, he has done amazingly, I treat him when he has been good and in the last 24 hours has almost learned to poo and wee in the garden. He loves his crate and for someone who hasn't owned or even trained a dog before though I'd done quite well (and with a bad back).
I wouldn't strike a dog and DO believe in giving praise, as I have done. My main reason for asking is that I have a two year old daughter and don't want him biting her now or in the future, I do understand that this will take time and am being patient with him (even when he had pooed on my lovely new carpet) This I don’t even mind, but I do want to get the biting thing dealt with ASAP. I play with Bailey in the garden with the water hoes and he loves it, I assumed that a water spray would just distract him from this behaviour not use it as discipline, I have used my spray on my daughter and she thinks it's hilarious so it obviously doesn't hurt, which was not my point in the first place. He quite enjoys it really.... I’m sorry if I offended anyone, but I’m really not being cruel to him, and wouldn't. I don’t smack or even shout at him for doing wrong. 
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13-08-2008, 08:48 AM
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Re: Water spray
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13-08-2008, 09:10 AM
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Re: Water spray
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 What breed is your new puppy? You sound like a good puppy dad!
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13-08-2008, 09:13 AM
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Re: Water spray
There is an article here that explains puppy biting and how to deal with it, and will help, but you do have to follow it 110% consistently.
The Bite Stops Here As your daughter is unlikely to be ale to follow the advice given at her age, I would only let the puppy near her under very strict supervision. The problem with children and puppies is that the puppy does somethign we don't liek them doing, be that jumping up, or biting, and the child naturally behaves in a way that is exciting for the puppy, usually screaming and waving their hands about, so the puppy continues or the behaviour escalates. Work on giving your puppy a good recall in the house, so that if puppy does get over-excited with your daughter and she can't deal with it herself, you can simply call puppy over to you.
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13-08-2008, 12:20 PM
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Re: Water spray
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You are also teaching your pup to be frightened of you, is that what you really want? Would you use a water spray on a toddler when they didn't do as you ask? It is the same thing, like the toddler, a puppy has to be taught what we want of them. Clicker training really is good for both owner and pup, it also strengthen the bond between you unlike using a water spray, that destroys the bond and make the pup frightened.
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13-08-2008, 12:33 PM
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You didn't make it clear what it is that you are trying to stop your puppy from doing, but in relation to inappropriate chewing, the following in a excerpt from Gwen Bailey's book 'The Perfect Puppy' ______________________________________________ In order to minimize the damage done by your puppy during these stages (3 to 11 months), it is important to deny him access to places where there are valuable or dangerous objects whenever you are not there to supervise him. The easiest, and ultimately cheapest, solution is to invest in a playpen where he can go when you are not watching him. This can be filled with a variety of objects for him to explore and exercise his jaws on. If you supervise your puppy's excursions into the rest of the house you will be able to teach him the difference between the right and wrong things to chew and instil the correct habit right from the start. Firstly, provide your puppy with one or two chew toys that he has not seen for a while. Leave them out on the floor whenever your puppy is in the room. When you see him settle down to chew one, get down beside him and praise him well. Then allow him to chew without interruption. If he ignores the chew toys and wanders away to chew something else, you will need to correct him in such a way that he thinks the correction seems to come from the object itself rather than from you. If you tell a puppy off when he begins to chew something he should not, he will learn not to chew such items when you are present. However, when you go out he will not necessarily know that it is wrong to chew them. Dogs do not learn rules, they simply learn the consequences of their actions. Instead, correction should appear to come from the object itself. If this happens he will learn that it is unwise to put his teeth on that object, and will be unlikely to chew it again even when left alone. To do this, keep a small water pistol to hand, or a plant sprayer adjusted to let out a jet of water rather than a spray. Just as he begins to chew something he should not, aim a short jet of water just behind his ear. The intention is to startle him, not to hurt him in any way. His reaction should be one of surprise and he should then wander away from this object to find something else to do. Hide the water pistol from view, look away and, if he looks round at you, pretend you had nothing to do with it. The correction will be most effective if it happens just as he is about to chew on the object for the first time. If it occurs after he has been chewing for five minutes it will be too late because he will already have been rewarded by his behaviour. If you are too late, distract him by rushing out of the room calling excitedly, encouraging him to follow. Praise him when he comes to you and then watch him carefully because he will probably go back to his new hobby, giving you a chance to correct him before it begins. ______________________________________________ I use this method, and I also recommend this method to clients, it works a dream. But you do have to make sure that your puppy does not see you with the water pistol (I bought a child small water pistol which fitted in my hand completely). It is very important that your puppy associates the feeling of the water behind his ear with the chewing or whatever. What I also do, is once a puppy has been surprised and wandered away from the object he should not be chewing, I wait a short while and then introduce an appropriate safe chew toy, and give lots of praise. I would point out that I only start with this method once a puppy is 3 months plus, under no circumstances do I employ or recommend that clients employ this method until a puppy is 3 months.
__________________
twitter me... www.fun4fido.co.uk "Properly trained, a man can be a dog's best friend." Corey Ford 
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13-08-2008, 01:14 PM
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Re: Water spray
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Don't think you have offended anyone, just a case of having to have 'broad shoulders' some of us are quite curt with our replies, it is not that anyone is trying to be nasty, just sometimes some of us don't think when replying, we just tend to babble on and say it as it sounds. If you pup is jumping up your daughter it is also a case of training your 2 year old, telling her not to run and squel, even when playing as pups tend to think it;s a game, the water willl I doubt be having any effect whatsoever in stopping this anyway. sure you have done wonders already and will continue to do so. Just keep asking questions - take it on the chin if you don't like the replies, but come back tomorrow and ask more, there'll be no bad feeling, just good sound advise! regards sue
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13-08-2008, 02:52 PM
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Re: Water spray
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As Gwen Bailey says the intention is not to harm of hurt your puppy/dog, but surprise him. I use this method (from 3 months, never before), then once the puppy/dog has stopped what it was about to do, I wait a while then introduce the desired behaviour, and praise. bailey210608 I responded above as I thought your post was in relation to chewing, however to condition your puppy in appropriate mouth etiquette check out this post which is part of this thread Hope this helps Angela
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twitter me... www.fun4fido.co.uk "Properly trained, a man can be a dog's best friend." Corey Ford
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13-08-2008, 03:07 PM
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Re: Water spray
Im sorry but I have to disagree with you. I would never recomend a water spray. It causes fear and it is a punishment, no matter how you describe it. Why rule your dog through fear when there are other ways of altering behaviours. Its completely unnecessary. Particually if you then use spays for other things (such as plants, even air freshners or polish etc) as the noise can then scare your dog when it is infact doing nothing wrong. This could then lead to confussion and in some circumstances aggression. In my opinion it is not worth the risk.
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13-08-2008, 03:25 PM
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Re: Water spray
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I never mentioned air fresheners, or aerosols of any kind, what do you think I am??? How does it cause fear exactly? Have you ever seen a dogs reaction to getting a jet of water behind his ear? I can tell you from (LOTS) of experience there is no fear there, only and kind of 'huh! wassat'?' Scooby style Did you even read all the threads before responding? If you did you would see the method described is not punishment.
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twitter me... www.fun4fido.co.uk "Properly trained, a man can be a dog's best friend." Corey Ford
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but she stopped that using this method. I did try positive training methods but all that taught her is that if shes doing something wrong, and i say no, she has all the time in the world to do what she wishes and above all, she can do what she wants AND get a treat after it.
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