Originally Posted by james1

I wouldnt unbalance the ingredients myself. Orijen do their stuff as far as research so by adding an extra complete food - extra meats and vits enter their kibble it will honestly mess it up - it could have the oposite effect too instead of doing them good it could overload them.

Originally Posted by Rainmaker

My dogs are around the 6KG mark too. Big dogs in little packages, though LOL I hear what you're saying about perhaps feeling you're not giving enough. Either grin and bear it (my dogs certainly didn't complain at the apparently reduced rations), or else cut the feeding amounts and add a raw meaty bone, raw green tripe or some raw mince (containing ground bone) or something.

NatureDiet (which I confess I had to look up) isn't that impressive sounding, considering. I picked the Puppy one as it'd be the most likely to have high animal protein and less filler (grain, veg).



That ingredients list doesn't add up to 100% (more like 73%), so where's the other ~27%? Notice the "MINIMUM..." next to the meat, rice and the veg? I'm willing to bet an extra 27% veg or rice is way cheaper than an extra 27% whole cuts of fresh meat... If it was meat they'd be shouting it from the rooftops, surely?

It's 48% protein and 36% fat so not too bad at all on that score. Note, though, that Orijen is already 70% meat and WAY more attractive than 'crap in a bag' brand dog food, those high in grain etc. My dogs have literally been grown, born and raised on raw food for generations, no kibble involved (except odd exceptions). Even they went mental for Orijen when they smelt it, and they will normally turn their nose up at any commercial food, not even recognising it as 'food' lol

You can also always add a little hot water to Orijen. It doesn't swell up like grain based kibble does and will likely become more attractive (heat + water = smell increase!). But as I said you'd be fine (even better off in a way) to supplement with some raw meat, green tripe or suchlike if you prefer. Feed whole LARGE raw meaty bones at least once or twice a week, more if possible. This will help keep the teeth clean, and the oral cavity free of disease. It'd work out cheaper than NatureDiet too.

In preference to feeding NatureDiet with the Orijen, you could try 400g Frozen Minces - The Natural Food for Healthy Animals from Prize Choice / AMP. They contain about 5% ground bone (for calcium) so they're more balanced than plain mince, and you can get a decent range of types to try out. They're cheap too (about 33% cheaper than NatureDiet), and being raw, more nutritious. Just pop a block in the fridge at night, and it'll be defrosted ready to feed the day after (and will "keep" another day again for the day after, but be sure to have a second block defrosting if you feed that way, so you don't run 'dry'!).

If they're not used to such things (raw meats etc) I'd get them settled on Orijen before I started throwing even more new stuff at them though. As an interesting aside, perhaps it's because my dogs are raw fed to begin with but I noticed tons of sloppy faeces when I tried Wainwright's for a week.

An immediate 'cold turkey' (pardon the pun) switch to Orijen and their motions were small and rock solid again the day after and ever since. I never did get the whole 'omg swap so slowly you can barely tell' thing.

Maybe raw fed dogs just have tougher constitutions

Originally Posted by Lyceum

That sounds like an excellent plan actually, thank you. I love the idea of the mince because it's clearly better quality, but I can do the same with that as I do with the naturediet, plus it'll work out cheaper. Only problem there is there minimum order is £60, and I wouldn't have the room to store that much, do you know of anywhere else to buy it?

Thanks for all the help and advice by the way, it is really appreciated.

Originally Posted by Rainmaker

"Balanced" is a pet food manufacturer's term designed to frighten people into believing pet nutrition is like rocket science. Balance is achieved over time, not "100%" in one meal.

If you don't want to look at it like that, use your own logic and look at it like this instead: By feeding a reduced portion of Orijen you're basically feeding 50% "100% complete and balanced" food, and 50% raw food as a separate meal. Raw feeding is most certainly very healthy and balanced. 50% balanced + 50% balanced = 100% balanced.

Balanced is such a silly term in this context though.

Originally Posted by james1

i dont agree with mixing two complete foods, topicals can react against each other, vit A can be overloaded causing toxicity along with vit D. Thet go to enough lenghts to analyse their foods more than other manufacturers. Even the way they cook their foods is different to get the best out of it - youve mentioned yourself the use of preservatives used in lesser foods. I really wouldnt when its the equivilent to a doggy 3 course meal

Originally Posted by james1

adding extra things like carrots or meat youve prepared yourself would be a different matter of course

Originally Posted by james1

I wouldnt unbalance the ingredients myself. Orijen do their stuff as far as research so by adding an extra complete food - extra meats and vits enter their kibble it will honestly mess it up - it could have the oposite effect too instead of doing them good it could overload them.
My 20kg springer is on 200g a day - the bag simply lasts forever and hes got bags of energy. My pups on 250g+ as im trying to get some weight on him, he plateauted for a good few months but has regained these last 2 weeks.

how much do you feed them at the moment Lyceum?

Originally Posted by james1

Lyceum, you can buy cheap frozen mince/liver from the supermarket which for the 2 pound or so should last a couple of weeks id think