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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 19-08-2008, 03:12 PM
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Re: Why Feed Raw?

These links are from the same site the rest of it came from, it's the site that I found most helpful when researching, if you have a good search around that site it will answer most questiosn:

What To Feed

Switching To Raw

I will explain what I feed on a daily basis when I can be bothered!
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old 19-08-2008, 03:26 PM
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Re: Why Feed Raw?

The above 2 sites I also used along with this one:
Krisannrio's Raw feeding site |

The few of us that do raw feed all do it different for what suits our dogs better
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Old 19-08-2008, 03:27 PM
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Re: Why Feed Raw?

my two are fed raw, i get it from landywoods, which i learnt about from this forum. the veternairy nurse at my vets said that she does not agree with raw feeding but as part of her diploma work she is looking at how raw is said to make dogs less hyper due to no additives being in the food and had to agree that there does seem to be some truth in this, and although mine are only 7 months old they have not had any health problems yet, like hot spots or dandruff or such, have never choked on any bones and they have chicken carcasses, and if you have room to store the food from a place like landywoods, it is said to work out cheaper than commercial food.
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Old 19-08-2008, 05:11 PM
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Re: Why Feed Raw?

Just a few useless stats and stuff :

Commercial dog food has only been around for about 100 years, how long has the modern dog been around for? Pekes have been around since 2000BC.

An american had the idea for it on a voyage to Great Britain. When he came off his ship docked in England, his attention was caught by the sight of dogs scavenging for discarded ships' biscuits on the quayside. (One question is were these dogs owned and cared for or were they stray dogs?)

James Spratt saw the need for specially prepared food for animals and turned his efforts to the production of dog biscuits. As far as I know these were based on ships biscuits.

And so the prepared pet food industry was born. Later, American companies like Mars produced canned food for dogs, followed on a commercial scale by Chappel Brothers in the United Kingdom who began canning a meat and cereal dog food.

Chappie dog food in 1935 was bought by Mars, 1954 - Pal launched in the UK, 1960 Chum is launched in the UK, 1964 - Chum dog food is renamed Pedigree Chum and begins its long standing relationship with the Crufts Dog Show in the UK. Silbury Soames is the first dog fed on Pedigree Chum to win the Best in Show award. 1980's saw Cesar dog food and Frolic. 2000+ Mars buys Royal Canin, Doane Pet Care (US dry food manufacturers) & Neutro Natural pet foods. (Mars timeline)

Extract from F.E.D.I.A.F. NUTRITIONAL GUIDELINES FOR COMPLETE AND COMPLEMENTARY PET FOOD FOR CATS AND DOGS (p53)
"There are proteins against which dogs and cats seem to react more often (Wills ‘94). Milk, beef, eggs, cereals and dairy products are mentioned most often whereas more controlled studies mentioned wheat, soy, chicken and maize as the most important allergens. However, it is not always clear whether these data are taken over from human literature or not. In addition, the data does not always enable us to see whether the high incidence is not simply the consequence of the fact that those proteins have been eaten more frequently by cats and dogs."

Last edited by Katherna; 19-08-2008 at 05:35 PM.
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Old 19-08-2008, 05:30 PM
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Re: Why Feed Raw?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Methical View Post
I have spent a few weeks researching Raw Vs Dried and i am leaning towards the RAW side of things i must say. If for nothing else apart from when me and Dias' are walking through the forest, the place youd expect dogs to inhabit should they be indigenous to this land, i did see many, or even any Wag bushes, or Iams plants, and certainly no areas of Pedigree Chum trees. I did however come across quite a few, very fast moving samples of meat, and a few bushes of berries and such that Diasy surely liked eating.

There is rarely any argument between humans as to weather processed and packaged foods hold an advantage over natural foods.

That being said and all the research i have done, i find myself feeling somewhat nieve about the two sides. Id love to start Daisy on a natural diet but i wouldnt know where to start. I was thinking of winging it and just going down the local butchers and buying what looked good and giving it to her. Thank god i read this thread first as i certainly would not have frozen any meat before giving it to her. That little find has scared me somewhat and i feel that kibble is a safer option. Yes i know that they can choke on anything not just raw meats but atleast i dont have to freeze the kibble or any other strange processes to stop certain disaster. However convenience, i dont class as an excuse to feed my dog utter crap so...

Can i have either a nice big list of what may make a truly balanced, health diet while totally avoiding crappy processed foods ?

If no one can be bothered to sit here for that long thinking and planning a comprehensive list. Please can you atleast supply a list of do's and don'ts ?

Im not being lazy and waiting for all you guys to do all the hard work, i am reading up on it aswell but so many people say so many different things its hard to know whats bull and whats not. I dont want a list to end all arguments, just a list that is likely to prevent me from killing my beloved dog while tying to improve her health.

She seemed ok from birth but in the last week she has started to behave very lethargically, she now has dandruff and ALOT of hair is falling out compared to what used to so i fear that 14months of processed foods is begining to take its toll and measures must be taken. I go to the vets about it but all they do is recommend a different type of dried food which contains Magical-digestivum2 and happydoggy enzyme complex. Which just seems to be the same crap im trying to avoid.

Thank you for your time.
Go get this book, don't be mislead by the title it's not just about raw meaty bones, it covers veg, fruit, and lots more, including don't s
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old 19-08-2008, 10:33 PM
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Re: Why Feed Raw?

In my mind any animal should be fed what it would natuarlly eat in the wild, people tend to use commercial food for convenience sake, after all you can grab a bag of dry dog food in your local supermarket when you do your shopping.

As a child I remember our dogs being fed on table scraps/left overs and bones, they were healthy, so this is how I feed my dogs now. My oldest Newfoundland is over 12 and when we bought her we were told if she got to 10 we had done well. She has out lived the rest of the litter, and it was a litter of 10 or 12... Can't remember now.

I don't have a problem with giving my dogs a small amount of a good quality complete dog food... One you can't get in the local supermarket! Because I think then they are getting a good balanced diet, but their main food is meat, fish, eggs, bones and left overs. I would never feed tinned "meat" because of the fact there is actually only the tiniest amount of meat in that tin, and I know what animal derivatives are!
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Old 22-08-2008, 01:31 PM
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Re: Why Feed Raw?

Right, i have read all the above websites and many of the websites connected to those ones and.....my god......Its a wonder these dogs actually enjoy living with us when all we do is esentially feed them agar plates for bacteria and disease to breed and infect thier very internal workings.

I have a friend that has just graduated to some respected vet school in london and she too said that after her module in nutrition...she felt ill knowing what have been going into her dogs she has had all her life.

So, I got to get daisy off these evil death biscuits. So i can waltz into a butchers, pick up some non-flavoured meat, freeze it for a day or two, thaw it and introduce it to her ? From what i have read starting on white meat and minced varieties is a good start untill they produce consistently dark, solid stools and then its time to get slowly inventive with egs, organ meat, solid uncooked non-weight bearing bones with meat on it ?

My question really is however, Daisy has become VERY good at holding her movements untill the right time. Obviously while she is getting used to her new diet her digestive system is going to be up in arms, but once she is used to it and happily eating RAW foods, can i expect the same kind of control over her movements or is it just fact that it moves through her more efficiently and is thus sat there waiting sooner?

What are the arguments for all of you that have researched RAW diets and have chosen to stay away from them ?

Moreover, what are the arguments for all you people who have assumed the man-made biscuits in pretty packaging are the best thing for your beloved pets ?

Im not critisising you, i am just interested in what the people on the other side of the fence are thinking.
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Old 22-08-2008, 01:54 PM
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Re: Why Feed Raw?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Methical View Post
What are the arguments for all of you that have researched RAW diets and have chosen to stay away from them ?

Moreover, what are the arguments for all you people who have assumed the man-made biscuits in pretty packaging are the best thing for your beloved pets ?

Im not critisising you, i am just interested in what the people on the other side of the fence are thinking.
Good questions!

I have researched raw for almost a year now and was always quite scared that it was going to take an awful lot of preperation and as we have busy lives I was never going to have time to prepare everything needed. I was copping out by feeding my dogs commercial food because it just somehow seemed easier.

The more I read how much better and healthier raw fed animals are the more angry I got with myself for "abusing" my beloved dogs by filling them with total and utter crap, even though I always used premium expensive foods.

Well about 2/3 months ago I finally bit the bullet, slapped myself round the face, and gave myself a good talking to. I love my babies so much so therefore why was I being too lazy to give them a better, healthier diet?? How wrong was I, its all so much easier. Yes I spend a bit of time liquidizing fruit and veg but as I know my dogs love this and its good for them, I feel good about doing it. My boy has always been a "take it or leave it" eater, but since changing over he gets so excited at meal times and there is never a crumb left.

I am now feeding my 17 month old and even my 18 week old puppy on raw now. They both already look healthier. And I'm happy now because the demon on my shoulder that was berating me for feeding them rubbish has now dissapeared

Sorry its a bit of a long post, hope you I somehow answered your questions
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Old 22-08-2008, 03:38 PM
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Re: Why Feed Raw?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Methical View Post
So, I got to get daisy off these evil death biscuits. So i can waltz into a butchers, pick up some non-flavoured meat, freeze it for a day or two, thaw it and introduce it to her ? From what i have read starting on white meat and minced varieties is a good start untill they produce consistently dark, solid stools and then its time to get slowly inventive with egs, organ meat, solid uncooked non-weight bearing bones with meat on it ?

My question really is however, Daisy has become VERY good at holding her movements untill the right time. Obviously while she is getting used to her new diet her digestive system is going to be up in arms, but once she is used to it and happily eating RAW foods, can i expect the same kind of control over her movements or is it just fact that it moves through her more efficiently and is thus sat there waiting sooner?
It had no effect on my three's control. Our 6 and 7 month old pups have better control than most of the adult dogs that are fed commercial food, so if anything I would say raw improves their control.

When I made the switch for Milo it had no negative effect on his stools, they firmed up over a few days and he hasn't once had diahorrea since we changed to raw. With the pups I did a straight swap, the day they came here they went straight onto raw! They both took to it instantly. Jayjay had no negative effects on his stools, just like Milo they firmed up over a few days and that was that. Trinny got diahorrea for a few days and then things started to sort themselves out but I think that had more to do with the crap food she was fed before she came to us than the raw. D
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Old 22-08-2008, 03:56 PM
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Re: Why Feed Raw?

SO where do you guys source the variety of meats ? I have read enough and seen enough to know that the meats on the shelves of Sainsburies, Tesco, Asda ect are far from quality.

The butchers seems the obvious choice but there's not a whole lot of bones and organs in the slabs of meat available there. So i need a whole animal.

Im not squeemish so i have no issue watching Dais' devour a bloody chicken, liver and guts all over the place. Is that how simple it gets ? Take feathers off, slice to show whats inside and then allow her to munch ? No that cant be right because i must freeze the thing before i feed it to her. DO i need to freeze all the organs aswell ?

Youd think after all this reading i have done that i wouldnt need to ask all of these questions. But considering its not my dog and i plan on giving my girlfriend no end of grief and guilt trips untill she stops feeding her death-biscuits i cannot afford to get anything wrong as i am going to be leading this initiative and i must install faith in her by getting it right.

So far i plan to start on chicken and turkey, then introduce some red meats like beef and if all goes well then start on lamb.

Once we are solid on all that i shall likely introduce some organs and eggs finally gettin experimental with things such as deer and venison.

My questions really is how to prepare this. I read that half the benefit of RAW is that they have to work for the food. THey cannot just inhale it they have to pick and rip at it, working round the bone ect ect. This cannot be done if the food is already skinned, chopped and frozen though can it ?

Would it just be easier to buy a rifle and go trekking ?
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