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Old 20-02-2010, 06:48 PM
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Dual Champion Dogs

I believe these are dogs who have won in the show ring and working trials?

Are there quite a lot of these dogs, and is it quite difficult for dogs to do well in both spheres?

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Old 20-02-2010, 06:53 PM
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Re: Dual Champion Dogs

We know quite alot of people who have fantastic mals in the show ring and in the rig . Not sure about other breeds though. x
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Old 20-02-2010, 06:55 PM
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Re: Dual Champion Dogs

i wouldnt say its easy as the different disciplines require different qualities.

conformation for showing and ability for working.

a good dual champ is hard to find.

a bit like a good woman roflmao.

go easy girls lol.
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Old 20-02-2010, 08:14 PM
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Re: Dual Champion Dogs

I know of a few dual champs

In theory it shouldnt be difficult (well, anymore difficult than making up a champion in the show/working world which is difficult in itself lol) as the dog in the show ring should be capable of doing the work it was bred for... Of course, the show world tends to go through "fads" of what is desirable which makes it more difficult!
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Old 20-02-2010, 08:20 PM
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Re: Dual Champion Dogs

Dual champions are few and far between. It takes a lot of time and dedication to achieve just one champion title. To achieve two is quite remarkable.
The majority of people who manage this are full time in the dog world, so can devote the time needed to train and compete
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Old 20-02-2010, 08:22 PM
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Re: Dual Champion Dogs

It depends on the breed some are easier and more dual purpose than others. It also takes a lot of work to achieve
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Old 20-02-2010, 08:29 PM
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Re: Dual Champion Dogs

Dual champions are not necessarily breed & working trials, it can be breed & obedience, or obedience & working trials, I assume also agility, I know of an ausssie shepherd who is dual breed & trials, and a few others that were obedience & working trials.
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Old 20-02-2010, 08:43 PM
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Re: Dual Champion Dogs

True but even obedience/agility championships are hard to get
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Old 20-02-2010, 08:52 PM
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Re: Dual Champion Dogs

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nicky10 View Post
True but even obedience/agility championships are hard to get
i agree gaining championship status in one is difficult enough, all i was pointing out is that dual champions can be a combination of any of these kennel club licenced events
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Old 20-02-2010, 08:54 PM
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Post Dual-Champs in the USA: not common, very difficult in some breeds

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinsley View Post
I believe these are dogs who have won in the show ring and working trials?
Are there quite a lot of these dogs, and is it quite difficult for dogs to do well in both spheres?
hey, tins! :--)
i cannot speak to the number in the UK or Europe, but they are not common in the US, and in *some* breeds it is exceptionally difficult to get a breed-ring Ch; in others, it is very complex, trying to get a working-title.

dual champion labradors - Google Search
Labs are among the breeds where getting a dual-champ is very hard - but they are also among the breeds with the MOST Dual-Champs. there is a show-type that is popular, yet there are 6 body + head Types within the Lab-breed - and 4 of the 6 types have a more or less difficult time getting a conformation-title, with field-type dogs having frankly zero chance of ever achieving a Ch.

this is a type Kerrybrook Kennels Dual Purpose Labradors - Chris Wincek that does not appeal to me at all; cream-colored British-type Flabradors... Talbot, Ch. at 18-MO - look at him in show-condition! IMO he looks like a Depression-era hog, ready for slaughter, ye gods...

below Talbot is Kerrybrooks Vince, MH in a head-shot face-on;
i do not like the mastiff-type flat breadth of backskull, tab-like ears folded down like page-corners on a blocky head, blunt foreface without much taper, bull-neck with wattles, football-pad shoulders, etc. these are HEAVY dogs, who tend to age fast, break down early (joints), and will eat themselves to lifelong blimphood by 2-YO, if not stringently monitored.
but... this British type is currently popular in the ring and has been for several decades.

for comparison, Justamere Ranch Labrador Pedigree Research -
that dog was born in 1939; today, no one would ever take him into a breed ring;
the spectators would laugh themselves clear out of their lawn-chairs and roll on the floor in hysterics.
in 1942, this dog was elected to the Lab Hall of Fame.
at that time, working ability meant more than a blocky head and beefy body.

the 6 types of Labs can be seen best here - LABRADORNET - Labrador Typecasting
WATCH the dog at the top of the page morph from 1960 to 2000 type, and then 2004 National Champ; its pretty horrifying.

Google prompted me with *dual champion*... ? Brittany or Viszla? - but no other breeds, which means that not-enuf ppl have requested info on Dual-Champs in other breeds to have any other categories to suggest.

to get a breed-ring AKC-Champion title, i must accrue POINTS American Kennel Club - Point Schedule
i must accumulate 15 points total; under at least 2 judges, and at least FIVE of them must be at a major-show.
say i own a Lab, in the northeastern USA - here is the District 2 schedule of points for Retriever breeds...
__________________________________________________ ______________
................................................1 POINT.......2........3...........4.............5 POINTS
.................................................. ..D..B.....D...B....D....B.....D....B......D......B

Retrievers (Ches) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .2..2......4..5......6..7........8...12......13..20
Retrievers (Curly) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2..2.....3..3.......4..4.........5...6.........6..9
Retrievers (Flat) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2..2..... 4..5.......5..7.........8...9.....14..13
Retrievers (Golden) . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4..4....10..12....16..20....24..29....39..46
Retrievers (Lab) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2..4....11..14....19..23....37..56....70..118
__________________________________________________ __

the difficulty of earning each point is a function of breed-popularity and population - there are more people with Labs in Penna than there are in Montana.
so my Penna-bitch would have to earn 5-points against One-Hundred-and-Eighteen other bitches in the ring - which is only possible at a breed specialty, and type comes heavily into play. regional-differences, like smaller red-gold Goldens in the New-England states, vs cream-colored ENORMOUS Goldens in southern-Calif, will doom many contenders.

OTOH if instead of a Lab, i owned a Curly-Coat, i could win a major (5-points) with only 9 bitches in the ring! Way, Way, easier to win... except Curlies are exceptionally rare. assembling 9 bitches in the same place requires planning, forethought, and often co-operation with Ur competitors. now THAT requires genuine good-sportsmanship - calling up the owner of a potential-rival to ask if they would enter a particular show, to boost the entry numbers for a Major-opportunity.

Beagles - many from the early 1900s from UK-stock -
Dual Champions

Dual Aussies dual champion Australian shepherds - Google Search

there are also Non-Field or Non-Working DUALs -
like Agility, Weight-pull, Flyball, Disc-Dog, Freestyle and other k9-sports.
dual Dobes Awards/Statistics/Titles | Dual/Triple Champions

U can be certified (owner / handler And Dog) as a therapy-team, too.
there are plenty of ways to achieve stardom for Ur dog, and all of them can be great fun; but working-types and show-types are continuing IMO to diverge, which is a great pity.

personally, i would prefer that ONLY dogs with at least one working-title or sport-title be bred at all, even if they are not conformation-champs; a CGC at the very minimum, before the dog is allowed to contribute to a registerable litter, would at the very least, ensure a decent temp.
but then - i;m a picky bitch! and no apologies...

cheers,
--- terry
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Last edited by leashedForLife; 20-02-2010 at 08:56 PM..
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