My dogs are crated at night as much as I trust them I have nightmares of coming down to a dead cat or rabbit. I don't see them as cruel if used properly they're never punished by putting them in there in my house. They go in there willingly during the day as do the cat and rabbit if they want somewhere to rest.

I would say the equivalent to a cot is a puppy pen not a crate. Especially as crate are used with adults dogs as well very often.

I tend to disagree with crates because I want my dog to learn how to behave around the house and to be able to trust him as much as I can (within reasonable limits) and Id rather adapt my house to make it safe than confine the dog in a cage.
But then I dont agree much with any animals in cages, which is why I wouldnt want to have rabbits or hamsters or the like. Its a personal ethical standpoint to some extent.

And yes anything can be cruel if used wrongly however there is more of a risk so to speak with crates...of course you could choose to beat up your dog with a toy but thats a bit extreme...whilst with crates the limits are not obvious and not everyone agrees..is 3 hours in a crate ok? but 4 hours not? or should 2 hours be a maximum? should it be different at night? where is the distinction between good for the dog and sheer convenience of the owner? There is more room for problems and dogs (most) dont express as much as humans their distress and displeasure...

I just dont agree with animals in a cage I suppose and would not feel comfortable restraining my dog this way.

So crates will not form part of my dog's training and routine, although I do provide him with a safe den but which remains opens at all times.

Its a personal choice and responsibility at the end of the day.

I have to agree with you regarding crating , when they are used sensible they are a blessing, most caring dog owners wont abuse the dogs by leaving them crated all day & then again at night. they are super when as you say small children are around having there mad moments to.

Hi - my pup is 17 weeks now and I was very dubious about popping her in a crate/cage. She was a very sleepless pup the first 3 weeks (worse than a newborn baby!) and a friend gave me her old cage to try - I set it up and placed Pennys bed in there with puppy pads in the front - she went in straight away. I have never closed the door, infact i took it off and Penny now seeks her 'me time' in there now. The cage is in the kitchen and I close the kitchen door when i go to work and she's in there during the night. She settled well as soon as i introduced it, i think its what she needed - her own space. I could never close the door on the cage thats why i took it off, i like her to have some room to play if she wishes but I know many people that shut the cage when out and if Penny decided to start chewing anything or acting up then I think i would have to do that to, but touch wood, i havent needed to as she's walked 3 times a day, an hour a time, probably to tired!
I'd suggest trying one and see what happens - couldnt you borrow one to try first before buying?

Where is the best place to keep a crate? I am considering getting one for our new puppy (when we find him!) I've read they should be in a place in the house where you will be alot, our downstairs is all open plan so thought a quiet spot under the stairs in the living room would suit for day time use, but, i'd quiet like the puppy to sleep upstairs with us, so, do i move the crate in the night to upstairs, or would it be better to leave the crate downstairs, and let puppy sleep downstairs?

Its a tricky one...you could always get 2 crates lol

If you are happy for your dog to sleep in or near your bedroom, your dog will be, IMO, all the happier for it...dogs usually dont like to be separated from their pack/family..and a crate in the bedroom is ideal in my opinion because it means you keep your bed to yourself lol whilst keeping the 'pack' together and bonding with your pup.
I have a canvas like crate for my boy in our bedroom for the night.

At the same time it is equally important that your pup has a quiet place during the day to sleep in - when he is left alone or generally especially if you have young children about - so a quiet spot under the stairs, especially since as you said your downstairs is open plan which means your pup will never be far from you when you are home, sounds ideal...

Dogs can have more than one resting place so you could either have two crates or have one as a simpler bed..or move the crate up and down but you may get tired of it
Not very helpful sorry xx

I think, to begin with we will put the crate upstairs at night while we're toilet training him, then once that is sorted we will just keep a bed up stairs for him and the crate downstairs. Just need to see how it goes it guess !

We started with 2 crates, one in the lounge and one in the bedroom. Logan(our german shepherd puppy) came to bed with us and slept in his night time crate, we set the alarm and got up every 3 hours to take him out for toilet breaks and straight back in the crate, he never has had an accident in either crate. Then he would go in his lounge crate in the day and when we go to work, we leave the door open when we are at home but he takes himself in there for a sleep whenever he chooses.
He now sleeps in his crate in the lounge at night aswell as we found he was panting a lot in the bedroom and was getting too hot. It took a couple of weeks of getting up and taking him out in the night to get him to go through the night without needing to go out for a toilet break, he now goes running into his crate when we get his bedtime bonio out of the kitchen and say bedtime and sleeps through until 7 am when we get up. He is 14weeks old.

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I have to say your description above of the crate being used in the same way as a babies cot is just brilliant!! I get so much negative reaction when i say i use a crate for Logan but yet he loves it and is so chilled in it we are very happy with our decision to use one.

Well done Rainy!!

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Hiya we use a crate as was advised to, he mainly sleeps in it at night & during the day we just leave the door open so he can go in & out, we had never used one before but he seems to like it.