Hi.

I did say I wasn't trying to start a debate, so I feel you should have started a new thread. Still less was I trying to provoke a rant. But...chips are fairly easy to find using...the detectors they are designed to be used with. Many a time in English Channel ports on the French side I've had to move the detector about for several minutes until I've found the chip, which hadn't registered when the detector was a centimetre away in this direction or that. The only conclusion is that they can be found using the detectors with a lot of accuracy. To call the procedure "dubious" is not something I will respond to. When I had a vet put it in, he led to me believe I had to sign something to "help find my dog if she got lost", which turned out to be a document permitting my personal information to be given to the pharmaceutical multinational called Bayer.

Obviously the vet wasn't helping Bayer for free, any more than dentists who display the name "Sensodyne" all over their front desks do so for free. He didn't even offer me a copy of what he was asking me to sign.

Many a time I've met people in veterinary waiting-rooms who have been sold lines such as that their dog needs a special drug to help them not to be so nervous on bonfire night. Yeah right. That's the sort of thing I might call "bizarre". Except it isn't really bizarre because the motivation for the behaviour of the tradesman who uses such persuasion techniques (or gets his underpaid underlings to do so) is patently obvious. Like all other professionals, vets try it on all the time.

For example, I guess most people who read this post will be aware of the con-trick about annual "booster" vaccinations, which are solely negative in their effect. It is surely obvious that removal of an easly locatable chip the size of a grain of rice will not cause great risk to my dog, nor require anything other than a short-lasting local anaesthetic - much less anaesthetic than a dog would get for, say, a tooth extraction! As for pain, she certainly experienced it when it got put in.

If the only reason you can think of for an owner to want a chip removed is theft (!), I can only suggest you get out some more and meet some more people!! (The reason I had it put in, by the way, wasn't because I had fallen for how "helpful" and "protective" it would be, but because I was emigrating and expected to return regularly to the UK. But things did not go as planned, and I am now back in the UK and expect never to leave it again with my dog). But for your information I have the receipt from when I bought her as a puppy, I have her KC registration docs in my name, I can prove my identity, I have records of when I had her chip put in, the chip itself is of course identifiable as the same one I had put in, and so on. People with different attitudes from yours are not necessarily criminals!!

The standards and practices and in some countries actual laws about microchipping are about money first and foremost. One also shudders at the thought of how a little bit of propaganda spend would get many "office-holders" of various types promoting even the mass microchipping of human beings as if it was all for our own good.

Fantasy? Well before anyone reaches that conclusion, they should consider that the European Healthcare Director of Oracle, the world's largest maker of business software, is on record as saying he wants to make microchip implants "available to everyone" in the UK. Here's a link to the article in The Times, in case anyone is sceptical.

Regards, Carrie

PS A company called Hills tends to be the one that tells vets how to run their surgeries in the UK. To practically all intents and purposes, they own BSAVA. Interestingly, it's the above-mentioned Bayer who do the same for GPs' surgeries.

PPS I have absolutely nothing against veterinary nurses, and believe you do a very worthwhile job, and most I've met have been competent and with a genuine care for animals, but I did encounter one once who insisted that dogs need meat in their diets. When I asked her why on earth she believed such a thing, she said that's what she'd been taught. I fully believed her. But what I didn't go for was the naive way she repeated such nonsense without having ever questioned it. Whereas 10 minutes reading up about it would supply any literate person with the required information. I didn't have the time to mention essential and non-essential amino acids, nor the meaning of the term "omnivore"! I've also heard the same ignorant assertion declared with apparent knowledgeableness by petshop managers. Especially if they don't sell Wafcol Vegetarian Complete dog food! Put someone behind a desk or counter and they often get in to "playing a role", thinking up reasons to justify "the way things are". Everyone knows sensation and pain are not the same thing - it's not elite knowledge only understood by nurses "and their colleagues". Nobody confuses them.

PPPS Harmeetjohal, I said in the title of this thread that she is "my dog". When you say you are "guessing" she "ain't" mine, you're calling me a liar. I do object to being abused when all I've done is ask a question in a courteous way, with no insult or offence intended to anyone, whether they would ever wish to get a dog's microchip removed or not. Please could you apologise and then we can forget what you said.

Forgive me, I've not read this thread fully, so I may be wrong. But, you want to have the microchip removed (For no GOOD reason) and to the people that say it would cause your dog unnecessary pain/trauma, you say ...So? Vets are rubbish anyway.
Or have I got that wrong??

__________________

I can't understand why anyone in their right mind would want to have a microchip removed.

We had our dog chipped before the pet passports was brought in, as we could not stand the thought of losing our dog.

__________________
Sorry about any wrong spelling, but I'm feed up of looking things up in the dictionary

Also as aform of id why would you not want to be able to locate your dog if it was lost or stolen a collar with id tag isrequired by law but can not be removed the whole idea of a chip or tattoo is the dog is marked for life!
Remember there is also talk of bringing in microchipping by law so then what re chip?? i asked my vet if he would remove a chip just to see what he said -hisreply was has it moved and is over the heart or in a toe or some place ? i said no i didnt think so and when i explained about you no longer wanted to go abroad he just raised his eye brows and looked over the top of his glasses!!!!!!!!!!!!!! So no my vet wouldn't remove a perfectly ok placed chip-we have one dog with 2 chips in it and we have left them both well alone.

Carrie, I do understand your concerns about having a chip in place, you are not alone in feeling that way, however, it is increasingly likely that permanent id is going to be required, so those who have had doubts are coming round (or having to come round) to accepting them.

That aside, while it may be easy to locate a chip, it's removal is not easy. The trauma caused to the soft tissues will not be without permanent effect. Scar tissue has a lasting effect and depending on where the chip is located could cause problems, not to mention the possibility and effects of infection.

It would appear that your desire to rid your dog of this chip, which I do understand, is overiding your consideration of the risks and effects of removing it and I would urge you to reconsider as the effects and risks of removal are IMO far greater than leaving it in place. I think you will find this is exactly the reason why the vets will not carry out this procedure and has nothing to do with any other agenda you think they may have.

And your views and rant against vetinerary procedures, while I share some sympathy with your views on a number of issues, is blinding you to the risks that you will put your dog through in order to remove something that is not, nor is it likely to ever give him any problems.

No ones starting a debate, or wanting to offend you but you cant blame people for wondering why anyone would think its only nessesary to protect a dog when you take it abroad. People dont come on here with the intent to upset anyone

Absolutely!!!

__________________



www.straydogsturkey.org
http://www.peta.org/index.asp


''A hundred years from now, it will not matter the sort of house I lived in, what my bank account was, or the car I drove....but the world may be different because I was important in the life of the animals and the creatures on this earth."


''There’s no honorable way to kill, no gentle way to destroy. There is nothing good in war, except its ending.''

iv not read the rest of the posts since this but are you stupid! yes an anesthetic will be used but your dog will be CUT OPEN to search for the tiny microchip! even after the pain relief has worn off which is used in the anasthetic the dog is likley to still feel some discomfort, have a possible risk of infection. never mind the risk of the anasthetic what would you think to urself if you dog had a 'turn' under the anasthetic?? there is a risk with every anasthetic. i highly doubt a decent vet would do this procedure nowing the risks andthe pointlessness of it but anyway good luck to ur poor pet

__________________
Becky

This has to be a wind up thread surely,
unless they are planning on dumping this poor dog and then it will never be traced back to her...
mmmmmmmmmmm seems very strange never heard anything so strange in my whole life..i thought a microchip was a great idea at least if your dog gets lost or stolen it can be traced,very very odd
Mandy

judging by her/his last post I would say you have a valid point there.