I am fully aware that rescues have a particularly hard job to do, quite likely moreso in the current economic climate, so I am trying not to criticise.

However, in as many days, I've encountered four people who have taken bitches from rescues, having been told they were neutered, only to discover these bitches latterly coming into season, and one now suspected of being pregnant. There have also been instances of people taking bitches home, and just a few weeks later (not sufficient time for the dog to get pregnant 'on the outside' - the bitch has presented with a large litter of pups.

Both before and after we got our eldest, we trawled rescue for a dog. In the first instance, after 2 years of looking, we realised that my daughter's nervousness around dogs simply didn't afford us the luxury of getting an older dog

Fast forward 18 months, daughter's dog fear well and truly gone, so we tried again, but none of the rescue's would entertain us because my girl wasn't neutered.

Despite looking for another bitch - we were told we couldn't because "accidents still happen" not sure if they know something about canine anatomy we don't

We even took out one Welsh Springer who had been raised with her litter brother, and was very clearly extremely heavily pregnant - the rescue missed it - even though she was clearly due to whelp probably within days they were genuinely astonished when I told them

I guess what I am asking to all those involved in rescue, how thorough are they generally in checking the 'reproductive' status of their bitches, I don't know if it is just me that finds this situation concerning, and it does seem to be randomly spread between different regions and therefore rescues

I though all rescues had a mandatory spay before release policy or a binding contract with the new owners to get the bitch done at 'x' point - but these people are being told they have neutered bitches, only to find this is clearly not the case

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No. They have a no breeding clause in their contract. Unfortunately some people are (insert expletive here).

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These people have ALL been told the bitch was neutered - incluing the one who turned out to be pregnant - that's not a breeding clause - that is, IMO cause for concern - and I am curious how widespread this issue is.

Our local rescues have a mandatory neutering clause before they release dogs and bitches - but there is cause for concern on how they are determining in some locations that the bitch has actually been neutered (dogs, of course are much more obvious)

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How can you tell if a bitch is neutered?

Maybe when the dogs were surrendered the rescue was told they were neutered by the owners and in the case of the pregnant bitch that was the reason the owner was dumping the dog but didn't want to admit it incase the rescue wouldn't take her?

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I think it varies from rescue to rescue (like so many policies). Of the breed rescues I have been involved with none had a neuter policy whereas the general rescue did.

I think this is true - to a certain extent rescues have to go by what they are told by previous owners. Some of the larger rescues are able to afford a vet check before rehoming all the dogs that come through their doors, some are not. I had a case that a bitch had supposedly been neutered (according to vet that had checked the bitch before coming from Ireland). She gave birth to a stillborn pup a week later .

I think another difficulty is that rescues are made up of dog lovers, not necessarily very knowledgeable dog lovers.

Having heard of a case where a vet made a mistake, then obviously mistakes can be made.

Add to that and call me a cynic, but I sometimes wonder if not all these cases of 'accidental' pregnancies because 'I was told she was spayed' are genuine.

What I don't understand is how people (and not just those with rescues) have a 'whoops' mating but only start to ask questions when it is too late to do anything about it and they have obviously taken the decision to have the litter regardless.

I don't doubt Rocco that some of them are not what they seem but knowing how stringent our local rescues ostensibly seem to be (although as referred to above - clearly missed a heavily pregnant bitch more than likely by her litter brother - even though the dogs had been there for WEEKS!!!) - it does raise a few questions.

As I said - I am not looking to criticise - I know there are organisations offering significantly discounted neutering rates to rescues - but appreciate it still may not make it affordable - again - particularly in the current economic climate - but I do still think it is a cause for concern

With great difficulty I would say - hence my question, and I suppose what steps (if any) rescues take to verify the information provided by owners.

Some are setting very stringent policies with regards to adopting dogs (but are more than willing for the same people - i.e. me and many others to foster and ferry dogs up and down the country at the drop of a hat) - but are not necessarily practicing what they preach in terms of neutering

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I think there is such a wide range of policies out there but our rescue would normally neuter all dogs before they are rehomed .. this doesn't give people chance to let them get up the duff accidentally or not

If our vet advises dogs may go out with clauses, i.e. puppies and we would check it up.

We recently had an old girl in poor health who had to have a tumour so huge it touched the floor from her belly removed amongst other ailments and the vet did not want to put her under another aneasthetic so soon if she potentially was already neutered which they thought she might be. SHe also has a clause with her owners that if she comes into season we will then cover getting this done at our cost.

We did recently have a female dog go out neutered - she had what looked like a spay scar but she was booked in at the vets for spay and first vaccinations. The vet called us to say was a spay scar (and our vet is briliant) and there was no need to open her up.... so we did rehome her as spayed upon the advise of a vet that she had been done....

These are the exceptions though to the rule, normally ALL dogs that can be get done before going out.

With my two dogs neither were done, I had to sign to say would get them done but no one ever checked up.

Seen it more than once, been there, done that and have the t-shirt only the rescue then turned around and said they never told me such things

When I was in the states I saw allot of bitches with little blue marks, I asked my husband what they were and he said it was a common practice now mostly in rescue to have a tiny blue line tattooed as proof of being spayed. I thought this was a brilliant idea and don't see why more people don't do it here.

Honestly if you looked at Maya now you'd see no spay scar and with her thick double coat it makes it much harder.

I can understand how so many owners feel, it's very distressing to rescue a dog expect her to be spayed and to find she's not or worse pregnant.

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in my rescue all dogs are neutered before they leave UNLESS they are too young(the pups) or have just been in season. they then leave under contract to come back to be done.

when the dogs first come in, the vet gives them a good lookover. she looks for a spay scar and has a good feel around as i believe you can maybe feel the scar tissue. cant always be 100% accurate tho im sure.

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Around 10 year ago I got a rescue black lab x from a rescue near me, they said all their rescues are spayed/neutered before they are rehomed, in fact I asked them and they said they didn't know wether she had already been done by her previous owners so would find out asap and if not, they would get her straight back in and have it done. I called them a week later as I had heard nothing, they still didn't know and they would ring me. Another week went by, I rang them, they hadn't found out yet. Now jess was a flighty little mare and escaped any opportunity she got (prob why she was in a shelter in the first place) if someone opened the front door she was gone, cue 5 hours searching, find her, bring her home. She even jumped out the living room window twice when it was warm and the Windows were open! Anyway, still don't hear anything from the rescue centre, until one day she is noticeably bigger! She had been putting a little weight on anyway as she was quite skinny when we got her, but this wasn't just 'healthy living' she had a round belly. I took her straight to the vets who confirmed she was pregnant! I called the rescue told them she definitely hadn't been speyed as she was with pups, the only response I got from them was oh dear, let us know when the pups are 8 weeks old and we will rehomed them! I had no previous experience of a pregnant dog nor whelping one. Jess went on to have 9 gorgeous healthy babies! (she had 10 bit one didnt make it) and for 7 weeks I did my utmost best for them and they grew into healthy bouncy pups, but by 7 weeks I couldn't take anymore, I hadnt planned this, nor was I prepared for it so I rang the rescue and arranged dropping them off, they went to a foster home and it was heartbreaking to let them go, but even more heartbreaking knowing there was 9 pups in a rescue that could of been easily avoided I like to think that because they were babies they would of found a home quickly but it still should of been avoided, and I did the best I could to raise the 9 little fur balls as well aa having a 3 year old son.

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