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Dog Breeding Discuss all topics related to responsible dog breeding. Including help and advice on dog breeding issues regarding the mating process, pregnancy issues, post birth issues and all other related topics.

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Old 17-09-2008, 03:13 AM
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Siberian can't hit the mark.

A friend of mine dropped of his Siberian husky to mate with mine. Every time he mounts her, he will pump for awhile but never hits the spot or enters her. When I tried to assist them, he became possesive of her and bit me twice, once in the hand and once on the forearm. Any help would be greatly appreciated. This is the first time for both of them, if this helps any.

Thanks
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Old 17-09-2008, 07:10 AM
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Re: Siberian can't hit the mark.

It is often quite difficult for two inexperienced dogs to mate. Most breeders will put an inexperienced male to an experienced female and vice-versa, so that at least one of them knows what they are doing.

More importantly however, even before the dogs are mated, have both dog and bitch been tested and cleared for the eye conditions from which some Siberians suffer? Have they both been hip scored and are the scores within the breed average? Are their pedigrees compatible and have you researched their pedigrees to ascertain whether or not there are any health/temperament problems in their lines? Are both dog and bitch of sufficient quality for them to be good breeding stock? How has this been assessed - in the showring? on the trail?
Do you have good homes lined up for possibly 8 or 9 puppies? Do you have the financial resources to pay the huge vet bills which will accumulate if the bitch has to have a caesarian, or if the puppies become sick after birth?
Do you have the capacity to take back any pups/adult dogs if the new owners are unable to keep them for whatever reason?

I'm sorry if this seems negative, but I am involved in the Siberian Husky Welfare Association (UK) - the biggest and busiest Sibe Welfare organisation in the UK, and we see the results of naive and indiscriminate breeding every day of the week. Since we founded the organisation in February 2007, we have rehomed 250 unwanted Siberians - a large proportion of which were bred by people who could not have answered yes to any of my above questions. Well bred, high quality, health tested Siberians are few and far between, but badly bred, poor quality, unhealth-tested Siberians are ten a penny and often end up in welfare like this poor fellow:



Mick
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Last edited by raindog; 17-09-2008 at 07:18 AM.
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Old 17-09-2008, 12:25 PM
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Re: Siberian can't hit the mark.

Quote:
Originally Posted by raindog View Post
It is often quite difficult for two inexperienced dogs to mate. Most breeders will put an inexperienced male to an experienced female and vice-versa, so that at least one of them knows what they are doing.

More importantly however, even before the dogs are mated, have both dog and bitch been tested and cleared for the eye conditions from which some Siberians suffer? Have they both been hip scored and are the scores within the breed average? Are their pedigrees compatible and have you researched their pedigrees to ascertain whether or not there are any health/temperament problems in their lines? Are both dog and bitch of sufficient quality for them to be good breeding stock? How has this been assessed - in the showring? on the trail?
Do you have good homes lined up for possibly 8 or 9 puppies? Do you have the financial resources to pay the huge vet bills which will accumulate if the bitch has to have a caesarian, or if the puppies become sick after birth?
Do you have the capacity to take back any pups/adult dogs if the new owners are unable to keep them for whatever reason?

I'm sorry if this seems negative, but I am involved in the Siberian Husky Welfare Association (UK) - the biggest and busiest Sibe Welfare organisation in the UK, and we see the results of naive and indiscriminate breeding every day of the week. Since we founded the organisation in February 2007, we have rehomed 250 unwanted Siberians - a large proportion of which were bred by people who could not have answered yes to any of my above questions. Well bred, high quality, health tested Siberians are few and far between, but badly bred, poor quality, unhealth-tested Siberians are ten a penny and often end up in welfare like this poor fellow:



Mick
Well said...
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Old 17-09-2008, 07:03 PM
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Re: Siberian can't hit the mark.

Hi Toro

Firstly - I totally agree with what Raindog has written.

Secondly - I think the fact that this dog has bitten you should make you rethink your plans! There's no way I'd be using a dog at stud that did that! His owner has been very irresponsible just dropping him off with you and has shown complete disregard for his dog and your bitch.
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Old 17-09-2008, 07:35 PM
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Re: Siberian can't hit the mark.

my mum and dad stayed the whole time when our dog was being mated. No advice on what to do as our stud already had a litter before ours so he was experienced.
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Old 17-09-2008, 09:56 PM
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Re: Siberian can't hit the mark.

The best advice I can give is take the stud back to your friend immediately.
Then take a long hard look at whether you are responsible enough to plan a mating.
Take the intervening six months to make up your mind and if you feel you will be going ahead, get the bitch health checked and look for a suitable experienced and proven stud.

If you go ahead now with a maiden bitch and and an inexperienced male you could end up with two very damaged dogs if he does manage to penetrate and she panics.
And I would not like to be in the vicinity of two such strong dogs if things do go awry.

Sgurr
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Old 17-09-2008, 11:32 PM
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Re: Siberian can't hit the mark.

Thank you all for the great insight. I guess I really have alot to learn and perhaps I should rethink this whole thing through and delay the whole mating until I learn more. There really are not that many Siberian Huskies here on the island, currently there are only four that I know of and all of them have never been bred yet. In the event that in the future I encounter the failure to "enter" are there any tips you can provide.
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Old 18-09-2008, 11:50 AM
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Re: Siberian can't hit the mark.

Quote:
Originally Posted by toro View Post
Thank you all for the great insight. I guess I really have alot to learn and perhaps I should rethink this whole thing through and delay the whole mating until I learn more. There really are not that many Siberian Huskies here on the island, currently there are only four that I know of and all of them have never been bred yet. In the event that in the future I encounter the failure to "enter" are there any tips you can provide.
Lots of breeders take bitches abroard to mate.

You would be best to go to a reputable experienced breeder.

Start looking and learning now and good luck for the future.
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Old 18-09-2008, 04:17 PM
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Re: Siberian can't hit the mark.

For the future,
If the male is not hitting the mark, as often as not it is because the bitch is not quite ready and her tail is still in the way. When she is ready, the tail goes sideways and the way is clear.
Sometimes with an inexperienced male, he gets too enlarged to enter (it's a two stage process with dogs) and you have to separate them, give him a rest and a drink of water and try a couple of hours later.
If she is ready, and he is enlarged to the right amount but they are still not getting the act together, you have to guide the penis into the vulva, which is not without risk. The owner of the stud dog should be in charge of the mating and do what guiding is necessary as the male is used to being handled by its owner. (The stud owner ensures the male does not have any genito-urinary infection on a regular basis so the dog is used to being touched in the delicate area)
Once they are mated, a maiden bitch may panic as the tie is formed - this is the second stage of the enlargement of the penis and the dog is physically unable to withdraw. If she is trying to get away, the bitch has to be held to the male, preferably by her owner, who is at the sharp end. When the thrusting stops, the stud owner assists the male to lift a leg across so the pair end up tail to tail. They may stand, move a bit (keep hold) or lie down.
If all goes well the tie lasts about 20 minutes and it's not unknown for both dogs to go to sleep. To break the tie, the male licks and licks around the vulva until he is able to withdraw, don't try to get them apart until they are ready. The stud owner checks that the penis has fully retracted into the sheath at the end.

The last maiden bitch my stud ESS coverd was a lovely lady but very slippery. She was ready, allowed normal penetration and then rolled on her back as the tie was forming. I had to help my lad to turn so having started doggie fashion, they finished in missionary position and rolled over quite an amount of the floor during. Healthly pups nine weeks later I'm glad to say, but both the owners had to be quite intimate to keep the dogs together and our respectives spouses at the far end of the room were just doubled up with laughter.

Sgurr
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Old 19-09-2008, 02:00 AM
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Re: Siberian can't hit the mark.

Thanks for all the information. I have chosen to hold off on breeding for now until I learn more. I did'nt know that there was so much to learn about, for the most part I thought that nature would just take it's course. Thanks again for all the help.
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