Mika & Rosso feeding advice please

Hi Everyone

This is a follow on from the above thread (see above)

Here is where we are now at, Rosso's stool tests are now back and all clear

After the course of antibiotics nothing has really changed, the vet advised me to put him back on his original diet (Purely Kitten pouches with probiotics sprinkled on top) as the bland diet of Coley hadn't made any difference and she was worried that after a week and half of bland diet he wasn't getting the vitamins a growing kitten needs

He is putting on weight, eating well, happy and full of energy but his stools are still loose, unformed and very smelly

I am not sure what my next step should be (the vet wasn't much help she just said as long as he is putting on weight and seems lively that she is not worried about him)

The breeder has suggested that I try him on Raw feeding for a bit to see if that settles him down, Rosso loves his food and whenever I have given him the odd raw meal (like lambs liver or chicken wings) he wolfs it down so I don't think I would have a problem with him eating it

I have read the 'Thinking about raw feeding - a basic guide' and feel a bit daunted, so if I did go down this route I think I would prefer the pre-prepared minces and have been looking at Natural Instinct which seem quite reasonable

So any advice, suggestions would be much appreciated, do you think this is the best first step to try or have you any other ideas, My head is swimming with so much info I have read this morning that I have started to confuse myself...

Start feeding him raw. There is a lot of information to take in, but don't worry about that, just make a start. You are very fortunate that your babe is keen on it so you don't even have to persuade him (see what he's trying to tell you???) The pre-made mixes are a good place to start - they will give him a good balance of nutrients and get the ball rolling. Gradually introduce chunks of meat, chicken wings, liver, heart, and maybe even whole prey if you can stomach it.

You will notice very, very soon that his stools will be firmer and will hardly smell. You will also notice that he loves his mealtimes.

How typical that raw feeding was suggested by the breeder and not by the vet. There's lots of help and advice out there for raw feeders: websites and some excellent FB groups. Feel free to PM me for details.

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Rescue cats for many years, currently one moggie and 3 young Maine Coons.

Natural Instinct certainly goes down well here and I would say an excellent place to start raw feeding. My kittens leave having tried raw even though I wean them onto prepared foods in case their new owners don't want to do raw. I would happily advise any one to feed raw and if, like me, you aren't certain about getting the balance of vitamins etc. right, then I would certainly advise looking at Natural Instinct.
Sorry to sound like an advert for them Other raw products are available

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How we behave toward cats here below determines our status in heaven. - Robert A. Heinlein
http://www.lambchopsiamese.webs.com

Im so pleased his poop is ok apart from not being right still spots crossed the new diet will fix him x

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All my children have paws!

Natural Instinct gets another big thumbs up from me and my gang, nice quality and always smells fresh. They are now packing it in slightly different tubs as the ones they were using tended to split easily....shame as they packed into the freezer beautifully taking up very little space.
Feeding a pre-prepared raw mix is Soooooo easy, a great way to start.

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Nellie Paddy Mitzy Milo Peggy Murphy

Millie and Monty, the White Devils!

Personally I would listen to neither.

Firstly, I would find a new vet who would be more supportive in getting to the bottom of his problems. Now that a stool test suggests that neither parasites nor bacteria seem to be the problem, the attention should perhaps turn towards food, with allergy tests and elimination diets to get to the bottom of it.

For that reason, I don't think a raw diet is the way forward either unless you are starting with a meat that he hasn't had before, which can be quite costly and sometimes quite difficult as it is harder to get offal and bones from the less usual meats, such as venison. Depending on the season it can be quite easy to get hold off rabbit (also check out Woldsway) but if he has had rabbit in the past, then the crux of the matter will be finding a food that he hasn't had before.

Zooplus.com sell a food that is made from horsemeat, which is an ideal starting point. But to make this as successful as possible you really also need to have a supportive vet on board as it can be a protracted and frustrating process that needs to be approached systematically and without straying.

Anyhow just my 2 cents. Best of luck.

Would also be useful to know what parasites the stool sample tested for. I would ask the vet about this.

I agree with Hobbs in that even though I can understand the vet's concern about his lack of nutrients, however I do not agree with her idea about leaving the loose stools uncontrolled. This can cause inflammation which will only get worse if left untreated, quite often leading to full-blown inflammatory bowel disease. UNLESS, of course with the addition of probiotics the stools produced are more normal? How did he resond before? If this is the case she may suspect his problems are due to bacterial overgrowth. You need a special blood test for this. However, cats normally have some degree of weigh loss with this.

I also wonder what his response would be to a novel protein diet eg Hills d/d is a prescription one but it contains venison which he may have had before? If stools were normal on a diet like this then it would confirm food allergy to the protein types he's had already. I seem to remember the fish and chicken so far!

Thanks everyone for the advice I really do appreciate your opinions and knowledge and am in total agreement that if this continues I may have to find a new vet, I was a bit shocked that when she phoned me with news that the tests were clear she didn't really have any other suggestions of a way forward and just said don't worry 'he's lively and putting on weight' so I am not too concerned!

I have just had a little encouragement with a much more formed and firmer poo from Rosso this morning, I have been feeding him for the last week a mixture of raw and Purely and he hadn't 'been' for a couple of days so this mornings results are a vast improvement!

Am I correct in thinking that Raw takes longer to go through the digestive system? Rosso is the most food crazy kitten I have ever come across, he will literally scream at me his dinner, jumping up me with excitement like a puppy and then bolts it down without coming up for air and I was wondering if that when he is forced to take his time (like with a chicken wing which yesterday took him about an hour to fully get through) that helps him not ingesting so much air etc?

When this lost have had some raw there does seem to less waste afterwards. I would have food out all the time for him though they do like to graze all day

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All my children have paws!

While I can understand how vet would be more alarmed if weight loss involved since this would suggest a more serious absorbtion problem ( however his constant hunger could point to this ) nevertheless this is chronic diarrhea we're talking about! The intake of air you refer to could well be the cause of the gas-can have other causes as well - but it's unlikely to cause problems with digestion!

Good quality highly digestible protein diets are more easily absorbed by the body and are also less likely to induce a an intolerance or sensitivity owing to their lack of additives etc so yes it does impact on motility which is slowed down. This is a good sign.The exception here is when there's an allergic reaction to a specific protein type and I do wonder about the fish and chicken. Which flavour is the Purely-not familiar with this-and the raw? Are you using the probiotics?

I would be more inclined to feed him one food source at a time and observe the response. This will make elimination easier and you'll know which foods to avoid.