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Cat Breeding Discuss all topics related to responsible cat breeding. Including help and advice on cat breeding issues regarding the mating process, pregnancy issues, post birth issues and all other related topics.

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  #101 (permalink)  
Old 10-10-2008, 06:08 PM
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Re: Cross Breeding...

I looked up RagDoll on Wikapedia - now I know that this source isn't always gold standard as it can be edited and added to by anybody, but I thought it made interestig reading as it seemed to me that 'RagDoll' was to all intents and purposes almost produced and marketed as a 'brand' by the original 'founder':

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Some of the original stock consisted of hardy, free-roaming street cats. Ms. Baker created the foundations of the Ragdoll breed by selecting kittens out of Josephine, a semi-feral longhaired white female Persian/Angora type, sired by several unknown male Birman-like or Burmese-like cats, one with Siamese type markings. Out of those early litters came Blackie, an all black Burmese-like male and Daddy Warbucks, a seal point with white feet. Daddy Warbucks sired the founding bi-color female Fugianna, and Blackie sired Buckwheat, a dark brown/black Burmese-like female. Both Fugianna and Buckwheat were daughters of Josephine. All Ragdoll and RagaMuffin cats are descended from Ann Baker's cats through matings of Daddy Warbucks to Fugianna and Buckwheat. By selecting individuals with the look and temperament she wanted for her breeding program, Ann Baker created the standard Ragdoll type.

Baker, in an unusual move, spurned traditional cat breeding associations. She trademarked the name "Ragdoll," set up her own registry—International Ragdoll Cat Association (IRCA)—and enforced stringent standards on anyone who wanted to breed or sell cats under that name.[4] The Ragdolls were also not allowed to be registered in other breed associations. In 1975, a group broke rank with IRCA with the aim of gaining mainstream recognition for the Ragdoll. This group, which included Denny and Laura Dayton eventually developed the Ragdoll standard currently accepted by major cat registries. The breed was selectively bred over many years for desirable traits, such as large size, gentle demeanor, and a tendency to go limp when picked up, as well as the striking pointed coloration. In 1994, a second group decided to leave the IRCA and form their own group due to increasingly strict breeding restrictions. This group later established the Ragamuffin breed. Keep in mind at this point that the ragdoll has a name that no one could use until Ann Baker's trademark on "Ragdoll" was not renewed by her in 2005.[5] Due to how the ragamuffins are bred (every 5th generation with certain other cats including the ragdoll), they are two distinct breeds of cats. Even though ragamuffins are in-bred with ragdolls to keep a similar ragdoll temperament they may show behavior and physical differences.
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  #102 (permalink)  
Old 10-10-2008, 06:20 PM
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Re: Cross Breeding...

Yes, the Ragdoll is a very interesting mix - certainly a bit of cross-breeding there! And Ms Baker was somewhat strange by all accounts.

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Originally Posted by Janee View Post
I looked up RagDoll on Wikapedia - now I know that this source isn't always gold standard as it can be edited and added to by anybody, but I thought it made interestig reading as it seemed to me that 'RagDoll' was to all intents and purposes almost produced and marketed as a 'brand' by the original 'founder':
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  #103 (permalink)  
Old 10-10-2008, 07:49 PM
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Re: Cross Breeding...

Didnt the origional breeder at one point drown a load of cats???for some reason.or at least threaten to...
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  #104 (permalink)  
Old 10-10-2008, 09:10 PM
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Re: Cross Breeding...

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Originally Posted by helz View Post
Okay... let me give a really obscure example of what I mean... lets talk about apples.

I have 100 apples, I am going to give you one, and tell you, you are not allowed to plant the seeds and make any more apples.

I have 99 apples, and you go off with your apple quite happily.

As you are not allowed to make apples with it, you decide to plant to seeds and turn the produce into apple puree.

I still have the same amount of apples, you still have you original apple, the only difference is, there is a load of puree in the world too. You haven't done anything to my apples, or any other farmers apples.

Do you see my point, of have I just made you all think I'm a bit crazy... about apples.
pedant... but if you plant an apple seed from your apple you won't get the same apple you would get a cross...

oh and (((((BIGHUG))))) *giggle*
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  #105 (permalink)  
Old 10-10-2008, 09:44 PM
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Re: Cross Breeding...

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Originally Posted by Jen26 View Post
What do you mean?
She's perfectly correct, the Bengal started as a hybrid between the domestic cat and the Asian leopard cat.

Liz
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  #106 (permalink)  
Old 10-10-2008, 09:46 PM
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Re: Cross Breeding...

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Originally Posted by Jen26 View Post
They are origianally alc x domestic shorthair both are cats and the same SPECIES as you call it, both FELINE.
No Jen, sorry, Felis is the genus not the species.

Liz

Last edited by lizward; 10-10-2008 at 09:54 PM..
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  #107 (permalink)  
Old 10-10-2008, 09:53 PM
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Re: Cross Breeding...

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Originally Posted by helz View Post
not sure of the name of the case, or how many there have been but an owner took a breeder to court because they decided they wanted their pet cat on the breeding register and the court forced the breeder to do so.
Really? Do you know any more of the background at all?

Liz
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  #108 (permalink)  
Old 10-10-2008, 09:55 PM
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Re: Cross Breeding...

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Originally Posted by helz View Post
Yeah, I see what your saying, but because some crosses are unhealthy, you cannot possibly say that all are.
All else being equal, a cross is likely to be healthier. It's called hybrid vigour.

Liz
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  #109 (permalink)  
Old 10-10-2008, 10:01 PM
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Re: Cross Breeding...

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Originally Posted by helz View Post
My same question/statment goes to you then Selks, what I cannot get my head round, is why you think they are doing anything to not preserve your breed.
They are increasing the amount of moggies and not decreasing the amount of peds.
I have to agree. If the cat they bought was on the non-active register then it could not have been used to breed registered pedigrees anyway. On the other hand if it was on the active register then it is hard to imagine that anyone would deliberately use the cat to crossbreed with a different breed when they could get more money from using a stud of the same breed.

Liz
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  #110 (permalink)  
Old 10-10-2008, 10:02 PM
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Re: Cross Breeding...

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Originally Posted by Jen26 View Post
There seems to be a lot of people selling british shorthairs un reg too, probably bred from pet quality cats, most of them dont even look like a british
In some of these cases I think the owners are genuinely confused and use the term "British shorthair" to mean "domestic shorthair" ie. Moggy.

Liz
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